I’m confused about precious metals

Profit taking, then investing some cash into stocks that are on sale these past few weeks.
 
here is a quote which explains some of it (Exchange Traded Funds):

Since ETF shares are inherently tied to the value of precious metals, investors must buy and sell considerable amounts of physical metal in order to back their shares.
In this way, they’re allowed to invest without the need to physically hold metal—a task that’s taken care of by the fund itself.
This system makes ETFs some of the largest non-governmental holders of gold in the world.
The quantities of gold that ETF investors hold creates some ability to distort
the overall market price under certain circumstances.

For instance, when massive amounts of gold are bought or sold on the open market,
it temporarily alters the available global gold supply. The result is an upward pressure on prices
when large amounts of the available supply are bought, and a downward pressure when they’re sold.
Although an individual investor has little effect on these price movements by buying or selling their ETF holdings,
large holders like governments can actually buy or sell enough gold to produce a noticeable effect of the global market.
 
turkeydance said:
here is a quote which explains some of it (Exchange Traded Funds):

Since ETF shares are inherently tied to the value of precious metals, investors must buy and sell considerable amounts of physical metal in order to back their shares.
In this way, they’re allowed to invest without the need to physically hold metal—a task that’s taken care of by the fund itself.
This system makes ETFs some of the largest non-governmental holders of gold in the world.
The quantities of gold that ETF investors hold creates some ability to distort
the overall market price under certain circumstances.

For instance, when massive amounts of gold are bought or sold on the open market,
it temporarily alters the available global gold supply. The result is an upward pressure on prices
when large amounts of the available supply are bought, and a downward pressure when they’re sold.
Although an individual investor has little effect on these price movements by buying or selling their ETF holdings,
large holders like governments can actually buy or sell enough gold to produce a noticeable effect of the global market.
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So do I keep investing in them or not?
 
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With the prime being bumped up 0.75% and another 0.25% or higher very likely in the next quarter investments from little guys are getting harder. The big institutions are slowing waiting for the market points they’re looking for to make some moves in or out of certain areas. For now most are just in a holding pattern but as soon as one or two entities makes moves then the market will heat up.

Side note … the $18 spot on silver is about the cost from mining to market asset in today’s world. I would mind picking up a little IF the price dropped slightly more BUT I ain’t paying $4 plus over spot (almost a 25% premium) for it.
 
Majicmike said:
So do I keep investing in them or not?
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If you are buying physical I’d say yes you should keep buying some. I include ammo as a precious metal too. 😆

I’m more leery of metal stocks and financial instruments. But I am not living in a mansion on a tropical island so take my advice for what it is worth.
 
Silver - Yes.
Gold - No.

And Silver back down to $19/ounce? Hell's yes.

There's a LOT I could write about it... so so much... but let's just say that historically speaking, gold is over-valued and silver is under-valued right now.

I highly recommend reading articles on Survivalblog.com about why you should invest in silver.
 
Invest in precious minerals (lithium)
 
Atla said:
gold is over-valued and silver is under-valued right now.
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Gold and Silver have never been over-valued when measured in fiat currency, at least since 1913, but especially now.

Silver is a No-Brainer Buy.
 
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MacEntyre said:
Silver is a No-Brainer Buy.
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But, would you say that it's a "No-brainer Buy" with a $4.95 per oz premium?
I generally buy from JM Bullion.
I want to place an order but 30% fee just keeps my finger off of the "BUY" button.
 
Red Marley said:
Suppose someone wanted to buy silver, what would be a good way to go about it?
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Local go to Kris Kringle’s coins on Creedmoor road (NC COPPERS) or your local coin shop. Online SD Bullion is cheapest while AAPMEX has a better selection but I would register at several bullion shops and sign up for the newsletters as daily specials are the way to go. I just got some pretty stuff at $22 an ounce delivered. I could have gotten cheaper if I’d used a check to buy. I also got gold AT SPOT on a flash sale from BullionMax/silverslayer.
 
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I have used Money Metals Exchange with good results before. Pawn shops and jewelry stores may have dealing as well. In High Point I have dealt with Coins and Stuff many times before. I think both silver and gold will be back up when people realize things are not as good as picture being painted right now by the government.
 
turkeydance said:
here is a quote which explains some of it (Exchange Traded Funds):

Since ETF shares are inherently tied to the value of precious metals, investors must buy and sell considerable amounts of physical metal in order to back their shares.
In this way, they’re allowed to invest without the need to physically hold metal—a task that’s taken care of by the fund itself.
This system makes ETFs some of the largest non-governmental holders of gold in the world.
The quantities of gold that ETF investors hold creates some ability to distort
the overall market price under certain circumstances.

For instance, when massive amounts of gold are bought or sold on the open market,
it temporarily alters the available global gold supply. The result is an upward pressure on prices
when large amounts of the available supply are bought, and a downward pressure when they’re sold.
Although an individual investor has little effect on these price movements by buying or selling their ETF holdings,
large holders like governments can actually buy or sell enough gold to produce a noticeable effect of the global market.
Click to expand...
So these folks sell you a piece of paper that says you own some gold, but they don't have to physically have the gold? So where the HECK is the gold??? I'll sell you a piece of paper saying you own about anything if I don't have to actually have what I'm selling. What a scam. I got a printer, How many of you want to buy some paper that says you own gold? I'll sell you all you want at Spot minus 5 percent.

EDITED BY STAFF FOR USE OF FBOMB IN PUBLIC.
 
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If it ain’t in your physical possession you don’t have it. I wish I had bought gold back in the early 2000s when it was ~500 an oz. I would cash in at 4-5x times that now.

That is the mentality I approach buying now, and I damned well hold the metal.
 
phideux said:
So these folks sell you a piece of paper that says you own some gold, but they don't have to physically have the gold? So where the fuck is the gold??? I'll sell you a piece of paper saying you own about anything if I don't have to actually have what I'm selling. What a scam. I got a printer, How many of you want to buy some paper that says you own gold? I'll sell you all you want at Spot minus 5 percent.
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I figure it would take a few hundred pounds of silver to have an impact on my family's long term existence, or yours, post-collapse. Can you haul that around with you when you need to bug out? or protect it 24/7 when you can’t?

That’s not a challenge. Just a question I don’t think a lot of folks have considered.

Edit to add. I realize that if there is a total collapse I probably won't benefit from those “paper” purchases, which BTW aren’t paper. They're just electrons.

That said, I figure I will be SOL either way, but supposing it’s more of a *managed collapse*, I figure I can hedge more of my assets with electrons that I can manage hiding, hauling, and protecting a few hundred pounds of the real McCoy.
 
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fieldgrade said:
I figure it would take a few hundred pounds of silver to have an impact on my family's long term existence, or yours, post-collapse. Can you haul that around with you when you need to bug out? or protect it 24/7 when you can’t?

That’s not a challenge. Just a question I don’t think a lot of folks have considered.
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Yeah, but post collapse what is worth more, all the silver you can carry, or a piece of paper saying you have all the silver you can carry??
 
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phideux said:
Yeah, but post collapse what is worth more, all the silver you can carry, or a piece of paper saying you have all the silver you can carry??
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I don’t disagree with that, and own some physical for that reason.

But I added to my post above. My thinking is there won’t be a total collapse, just like Germany continued to exist in the 1930’s Weimar Republic of hyperinflation and worthless money. By the end of that decade they were still able to launch a near overrun of the entire continent.
 
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MacEntyre said:
Gold and Silver have never been over-valued when measured in fiat currency, at least since 1913, but especially now.

Silver is a No-Brainer Buy.
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Sorry, I meant in terms of historical gold:silver ratio which was 47:1 during the 20th century. At this moment, per APMEX(Which is where I buy mine), we are looking at $1,719.30 for gold and $19.04 for silver. Or a 90:1 ratio.

It's this way because gold is over-valued and silver is under-valued.

If it were to change to the 47:1 historical ratio, we'd be looking at $36.58/silver ounce.

Thus, undervalued.

But yes, always buy physical. If you can't hold it one hand and protect it with a rifle in the other, you don't own squat.
 
Yeah I don’t stack for collapse. I have other things for that scenario. I just buy silver when dollar to silver ratio is right then if silver goes way up I sell. If the silver to gold ratio changes from 90:1 to 50:1 I trade my silver for gold. Then depending on silver , gold, and dollar is where it goes next, You either turn dollars into more dollars or silver into more silver but never any real risk as long as no buying when high or panic selling.….Just my opinion.
 
One of my key factors is spot versus cost of production. The silver production cost is now estimated to be between $18 and $19 with the current fuel prices. Unless some entity (China, large bank, heavy investors, etc) makes a huge dump on the market I don’t think it can get much lower.
 
NCFubar said:
One of my key factors is spot versus cost of production. The silver production cost is now estimated to be between $18 and $19 with the current fuel prices. Unless some entity (China, large bank, heavy investors, etc) makes a huge dump on the market I don’t think it can get much lower.
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It’s been pretty close, ac to within 50 cents, for the spot price, recentlyl. Now buying at that price ...
 
noway2 said:
It’s been pretty close, ac to within 50 cents, for the spot price, recentlyl. Now buying at that price ...
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I don’t expect to buy at spot but I ain’t paying $4 plus over it. The best I’ve seen on bullion (Eagles and such I don’t expect to see down at spot plus level) is $22 for 10oz bars … roughly spot +15%. Not bad but still I remember paying 5% to maybe 7% over spot a few years back … I remember sales at 79¢ over spot for 10oz bars right at 2016 election and now it’s $3.99 over spot.
 
NCFubar said:
I don’t expect to buy at spot but I ain’t paying $4 plus over it.
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True, there is that. Of course the ask price ag which someone will buy is less.JM bullion has a calculator of “how has my investment performed” and by it, I’ve lost money. Then again, I’m not a short term speculator and had I bought back I. the early 02’s when the commercials ere saying buy gold now, I’d be sitting pretty.
 
Atla said:
Sorry, I meant in terms of historical gold:silver ratio which was 47:1 during the 20th century. At this moment, per APMEX(Which is where I buy mine), we are looking at $1,719.30 for gold and $19.04 for silver. Or a 90:1 ratio.

It's this way because gold is over-valued and silver is under-valued.

If it were to change to the 47:1 historical ratio, we'd be looking at $36.58/silver ounce.

Thus, undervalued.

But yes, always buy physical. If you can't hold it one hand and protect it with a rifle in the other, you don't own squat.
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That’s just math, it doesn’t mean that gold is over valued and silver is under valued. It shows that the price ratio isn’t what it once was, but it doesn’t explain WHY.

Websites selling silver love to point to this ratio as a way to get buyers okay with their huge premium, and it must be working for them.
 
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