Masks seized by .Gov from hoarder

I wonder if they offered to purchase it first? Pretty messed up that they just came and took his stuff. I don't care what it is, it ain't right to just take somebody's stuff. That's robbery, it wasn't "seized", it was stolen. Plain and simple.

I wonder if the boys got all kitted up and kicked the door in to get the stuff?

It's not his fault that the NY and NJ health department's didn't plan ahead and this man shouldn't be punished for their lack of planning and not being good at their jobs.

WTF!
 
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Lets get real about price gouging. Under normal circumstances you see someone taking the initiative to load up on supplies in an area not effected and transport them to an affected area at a profit. I don't really have an issue with that. As long as they are not absolute jerks on their pricing. Then again, the market will be part of setting that price too. It's worth what someone will pay.

This isn't normal circumstances. There is no where in this country you can amass supplies that they are not needed. There may be less need. But no one is expecting not to need what they have. They depleted the market to help drive up their pricing. And instead of people in an effected area being helped by it, people everywhere are being hurt by the inability to access needed equipment. IMO, screw him on this one. He's lucky he's getting fair market value.
 
I wonder if they offered to purchase it first? Pretty messed up that they just came and took his stuff. I don't care what it is, it ain't right to just take somebody's stuff. That's robbery, it wasn't "seized", it was stolen. Plain and simple.

I wonder if the boys got all kitted up and kicked the door in to get the stuff?

It's not his fault that the NY and NJ health department's didn't plan ahead and this man shouldn't be punished for their lack of planning and not being good at their jobs.

WTF!
That’s what’s screwed up. If the guy didn’t steal them they are his. Shity way to make a dollar but he planned better than the politians and Hospitals. As much as a asshole I think he is, it’s his right to do what he wants with them.
 
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Is anyone aware that under red flag led, they show up, seize your weapons and ammo, then “destroy” the ammo?

that’s a lot worse than receiving fair market value.
 
Lets get real about price gouging. Under normal circumstances you see someone taking the initiative to load up on supplies in an area not effected and transport them to an affected area at a profit. I don't really have an issue with that. As long as they are not absolute jerks on their pricing. Then again, the market will be part of setting that price too. It's worth what someone will pay.

This isn't normal circumstances. There is no where in this country you can amass supplies that they are not needed. There may be less need. But no one is expecting not to need what they have. They depleted the market to help drive up their pricing. And instead of people in an effected area being helped by it, people everywhere are being hurt by the inability to access needed equipment. IMO, screw him on this one. He's lucky he's getting fair market value.
So....in you opinion if he was not trying to sell any...just keep it for himself...would the. Gov have a right to just take it?
 
Not saying I like it but how is this different from the state building a road. They need your land, they tell you how much it's worth, pay that and then take your land. Doesn't matter that you did or didn't have it for sale.
 
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A reply made to another commenter:
If these schmucks paid for the items, then the goods are their private property.
Are you OK with .gov declaring your home (if you have one) no longer yours
because you asked for more than what your neighbor sold his for? These
hoarders may be bad people, we must also remember private property is
part of the backbone of America and Western civilization.
 
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So they stole all of his product and are only going to pay him pre-panic prices. Not clear if that’s retail or wholesale but regardless, he may still lose out financially despite being a better planner than the masses.

Depending on how deeply he’s gouging people, it changes my view on how much of an ass he is. Regardless, the gov should have no legal standing on taking his stuff. Rather, they should negotiate a fair price to buy it all, maybe 2-3x msrp, not 5-10x though.
 
I wonder if they offered to purchase it first? Pretty messed up that they just came and took his stuff. I don't care what it is, it ain't right to just take somebody's stuff. That's robbery, it wasn't "seized", it was stolen. Plain and simple.

I wonder if the boys got all kitted up and kicked the door in to get the stuff?

It's not his fault that the NY and NJ health department's didn't plan ahead and this man shouldn't be punished for their lack of planning and not being good at their jobs.

WTF!


From the article.

"HHS said it will pay the owner of the hoarded equipment the “fair market value” for the supplies, based on prices before the coronavirus was declared a pandemic. "
 
Well, they could have taken it as evidence while waiting for him to produce evidence that he owned it, then had the IRS review the documents to ensure that he properly reported all income, and then returned everything to him when they wrap up in a year or two.

I don’t think that they should take personal property, but I suppose they could pass an emergency declaration preventing sales above some price. It’s easy to say that the guy planned ahead and should profit, but what if the hoarder was a corporation and it controlled literally 75% of the total inventory!
 
but what if the hoarder was a corporation and it controlled literally 75% of the total inventory!

That doesn’t happen with necessities. If there’s a market, there will be a lot of different manufacturers. That’s the American way.
 
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I am on the fence about this one. Free enterprise is all well and good but if you engage in it you have to do so in the same way everyone else does. Meaning he might have planned ahead and bought up a lot of stock but he didn't plan for the down side. His down side was the gov. stepping in but in the free market stuff happens and he didn't plan for that.
 
Dumbass should have hoarded some ammo too - maybe he'd still have his masks. amirite?
 
I am on the fence about this one. Free enterprise is all well and good but if you engage in it you have to do so in the same way everyone else does. Meaning he might have planned ahead and bought up a lot of stock but he didn't plan for the down side. His down side was the gov. stepping in but in the free market stuff happens and he didn't plan for that.
I don’t follow. He should’ve planned for the down side but in this case it’s the .gov stomping through the sandbox doing whatever they want, it’s not a market issue that he failed to see. What was he doing that wasn’t like everyone else? Price gouging? Pretty much everyone is gouging on masks right now.
 
I don’t follow. He should’ve planned for the down side but in this case it’s the .gov stomping through the sandbox doing whatever they want, it’s not a market issue that he failed to see. What was he doing that wasn’t like everyone else? Price gouging? Pretty much everyone is gouging on masks right now.


I probably didn't explain it very well. Life ain't fair. Neither is free enterprise. You have to ride lifes ups and downs. Same way with free enterprise. Unless this guy has been living under a rock for the last 40 years he should have known that he wasn't going to get away with charging an outrageous price for a necessary item in times of a pandemic.
 
I'm just going to leave this here:

The Fourth Amendment of the U.S. Constitution provides that "[t]he right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly.

Whether you think he's an asshat or not, he is protected by the fourth amendment to be secure in his effects. The government deciding that they need it more than he does is exactly why we have the fourth amendment.
 
That doesn’t happen with necessities. If there’s a market, there will be a lot of different manufacturers. That’s the American way.
You mean like with oil, or communications, or epi-pens, or a thousand other examples where business found a way to control the market?
 
I'm just going to leave this here:

The Fourth Amendment of the U.S. Constitution provides that "[t]he right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly.

Whether you think he's an asshat or not, he is protected by the fourth amendment to be secure in his effects. The government deciding that they need it more than he does is exactly why we have the fourth amendment.


Likewise.: A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

And you see where we are on that front.
 
Likewise.: A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

And you see where we are on that front.

Only because we allow it.
 
So they stole all of his product and are only going to pay him pre-panic prices. Not clear if that’s retail or wholesale but regardless, he may still lose out financially despite being a better planner than the masses.

Depending on how deeply he’s gouging people, it changes my view on how much of an ass he is. Regardless, the gov should have no legal standing on taking his stuff. Rather, they should negotiate a fair price to buy it all, maybe 2-3x msrp, not 5-10x though.
How about a trade instead of cash? I've always wanted my own A-10 Warthog.
 
Sounds like where he went sideways was when he tried to sell them for a tidy profit. There is a lesson here. It's a lesson about the truth of what is going to happen during any sort of crises. On several occasions I have stated that if you take away the false veneer of "officialdom" that the behavior of cops is really no different than common thugs and bullies. So look at this from a different angle. You are a prepper. You have stores of food. Your neighbor doesn't and is starting to starve. You, being the smart prepper squirreled away more than you will need or even want on the idea that you will make a tidy profit under the right circumstances that most couldn't see coming but you were wise enough to see. So, you offer to sell your neighbor a case of beans for what pre-event would have been an outrageously ridiculous price, but in your mind it's just supply and demand, free markets and all that jazz. How long do you think it's going to be before word spreads and a group of guys with guns shows up to take try to it from you by force. Oh, and remember, you live in New Jersey-stan and can't have a gun and even if you did the invading force would be greater than 10x your ability to resist. That's basically what happened to this guy. It matters not that the invading thugs wore badges and claimed to have "authority" over him, when in reality all they had was supremacy of force.
Not saying I like it but how is this different from the state building a road. They need your land, they tell you how much it's worth, pay that and then take your land. Doesn't matter that you did or didn't have it for sale.
If people want to put a stop to that then they need to respond accordingly and extract the iron price from those who try.
 
From the article.

"HHS said it will pay the owner of the hoarded equipment the “fair market value” for the supplies, based on prices before the coronavirus was declared a pandemic. "
This is a problem, because the fair market value before pandemic declaration is NOT the fair market value NOW. May not be 10X, but it's SOME x.
 
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You mean like with oil, or communications, or epi-pens, or a thousand other examples where business found a way to control the market?

none hold 75%,,, your forgot Power Company’s. That’s the best example.
 
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And that is different from the 4th how????

It isn't. And the more we keep sitting back and allowing our rights to be eroded the more they will be. Too many people have become complacent and defend these erosions saying well this is different, its an emergency or whatever the talking heads tell people to think and they keep taking more.

Eventually we are going to have to stop allowing them to infringe on our natural rights. But it can't be done by one person or a handful.

And unfortunately, history dictates that we are going to have to have them stripped almost entirely before enough people will band together to stop them.
 
none hold 75%,,, your forgot Power Company’s. That’s the best example.
There are many examples where a market was controlled by a single member or a small handful working together, the 75% figure is pretty arbitrary. Utilities were all good examples at one time, does anyone thing that they’d be able to get safe clean drinking water delivered to their homes with 6 or 7 nines reliability for pennies per gallon without government intervention? Railroads, telephone, and on and on.
 
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