M1 Garand Questions

J.R Priddy

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What's best options for shooting modern ammo what needs to be changed? The ammo I have is similar to M2 ball as far as velocities and grain weight
 
Use M2 Ball or be prepared to buy a replacement op-rod.
Pressure curves on modern ammo is different than the original M2 Ball load.
 
Isn’t surplus ball still cheaper ?
I just picked the M1 up Friday I'm trying to learn the does an donts before i take it out. Dont want to mess it up everything is date correct except the barrel it's an LMR 53 I think
 
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Check out the adjustable gas plugs Midway and others have for sale. Get one that adjusts the volume rather than the bleed off method, that method makes the rifle operate more consistent.
 
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Federal and Prvi make m1 specific ammo.

I handload personally. I use 4895 or 4064 and keep it at around 2700 to 2750 fps with 150gr hornady fmjs. No issues.

There is a video on youtube showing all sorts if different ammo in use and speed effects on the oprod compared to m2...full30 maybe?

Enjoy your m1..and take care of it..fine piece if gear!
 
Federal and Prvi make m1 specific ammo.

I handload personally. I use 4895 or 4064 and keep it at around 2700 to 2750 fps with 150gr hornady fmjs. No issues.

There is a video on youtube showing all sorts if different ammo in use and speed effects on the oprod compared to m2...full30 maybe?

Enjoy your m1..and take care of it..fine piece if gear!
Thanks been after one for a long time finally got one.
 
For the record...there is no need to get an aftermarket gas screw...milsurp and commercial ammo have similar oprod speed and the dangers of "bent oprods" are WAAAAAAYYY overblown...

properly grease your rifle....ensure the oprod spring is in spec and shoot what you want...
 
For the record...there is no need to get an aftermarket gas screw...milsurp and commercial ammo have similar oprod speed and the dangers of "bent oprods" are WAAAAAAYYY overblown...

properly grease your rifle....ensure the oprod spring is in spec and shoot what you want...

I am just quoting this for truth. Back in the day, I did buy a ported plug (not the adjustable one) from Creedmoor Sports just for "insurance" purposes, but what I have seen from folks that test these things is that most damage comes from improper lubrication and maintenance. If the rifle is properly lubed and maintained, and everything is in spec, then you should be able to shoot most any normal ammo without issues. If you are not going to check the springs periodically or be diligent with proper lubrication, then you should definitely buy the ported plug.

As for choosing ammo, the PPU is excellent and can be bought pretty reasonably online in bulk. That said, if you can find some Greek HXP surplus or Lake City surplus, it is generally excellent ammo. Ethiopian surplus is also pretty decent and cheap if you can find it. Danish surplus is okay, but it is berdan primed and not easily reloadable. Korean surplus can be hit or miss, depending on lot numbers. Iranian stuff is junk and should probably be avoided altogether or pulled down for components.
 
I just picked the M1 up Friday I'm trying to learn the does an donts before i take it out. Dont want to mess it up everything is date correct except the barrel it's an LMR 53 I think

And there IS a milsurp picture thread in this subforum, you know. For posting pictures of newly acquired milsurps and such... ;)
 
I am just quoting this for truth. Back in the day, I did buy a ported plug (not the adjustable one) from Creedmoor Sports just for "insurance" purposes, but what I have seen from folks that test these things is that most damage comes from improper lubrication and maintenance. If the rifle is properly lubed and maintained, and everything is in spec, then you should be able to shoot most any normal ammo without issues. If you are not going to check the springs periodically or be diligent with proper lubrication, then you should definitely buy the ported plug.

As for choosing ammo, the PPU is excellent and can be bought pretty reasonably online in bulk. That said, if you can find some Greek HXP surplus or Lake City surplus, it is generally excellent ammo. Ethiopian surplus is also pretty decent and cheap if you can find it. Danish surplus is okay, but it is berdan primed and not easily reloadable. Korean surplus can be hit or miss, depending on lot numbers. Iranian stuff is junk and should probably be avoided altogether or pulled down for components.
For the record and all.... :)


 
I actually had a mini panic attack this year at Camp Butner during my first relay in the Garand match at the Eastern Games. I had just finished fast prone and suddenly "remembered" that I had put the ported plug in my H&R match rifle. I couldn't think of a good way to check it, because you do NOT want to be that guy looking down the barrel of your own rifle while still on the line. Luckily, when I checked it coming off the line after standing, it was just a false memory and I had actually remembered to put the original back on that rifle last year, so I was good. I was worried for a few minutes there, because I did NOT want to get caught using an illegal rifle, even if it was by accident. In retrospect, I think the armorers are supposed to check the plug when they weigh your trigger, but I didn't really notice them looking at it when they put the weights on it.
 
Well, I will put my spin on this from my exciting experience. I have shot a Garand since I was about 15. I am 68 now. I have handloaded for a little longer than that, and most of the rounds through my several Garands have been handloads. I already had plenty of 30/06 military ball ammo in addition to my reloads when I bought the M1 ($65) because I had bought a 1903 Springfield several years before and shot it quite a bit. I also read a lot of Jack O'Connor and found that one of his favorite loads for 30/06 did quite nicely in my 1903. It was a load using IMR 4350 powder. The charge was below the max listed in the Hornady manual. I usually used IMR 4064 in 30/06 but did load up some with the IMR 4350 O'Connor load for deer hunting. That O'Connor load stripped the op rod off when I fire one. The replacement op rods were inexpensive back then, so I got a new one as well as a new bolt. I have never shot rounds with slow powder in any of my Garands since that day and have had no problems after thousands of my rounds that contained IMR 4064.

My problem with shooting commercial hunting ammo out of my Garands comes from the fact that I do not know what powders they use in those rounds. There is really no need to shoot anything but ammo that is specifically designed for an M1. M1-specific ammo is readily available from several makers, and it is just as easy to put a fast burning rifle powder in a reload as it is to put in a slow burning powder.
 
Interesting...,I've medalled the last 2 years at Butner in the cmp games matches with....155gr palma bullets and....... IMR4350.
It's a purpose built JCG match rifle, legal in all aspects, and I keep it well greased. I also replace the recoil spring every year.
Knock on wood, lol, but it's never shucked or bent an op rod.
 
Well, I will put my spin on this from my exciting experience. I have shot a Garand since I was about 15. I am 68 now. I have handloaded for a little longer than that, and most of the rounds through my several Garands have been handloads. I already had plenty of 30/06 military ball ammo in addition to my reloads when I bought the M1 ($65) because I had bought a 1903 Springfield several years before and shot it quite a bit. I also read a lot of Jack O'Connor and found that one of his favorite loads for 30/06 did quite nicely in my 1903. It was a load using IMR 4350 powder. The charge was below the max listed in the Hornady manual. I usually used IMR 4064 in 30/06 but did load up some with the IMR 4350 O'Connor load for deer hunting. That O'Connor load stripped the op rod off when I fire one. The replacement op rods were inexpensive back then, so I got a new one as well as a new bolt. I have never shot rounds with slow powder in any of my Garands since that day and have had no problems after thousands of my rounds that contained IMR 4064.

My problem with shooting commercial hunting ammo out of my Garands comes from the fact that I do not know what powders they use in those rounds. There is really no need to shoot anything but ammo that is specifically designed for an M1. M1-specific ammo is readily available from several makers, and it is just as easy to put a fast burning rifle powder in a reload as it is to put in a slow burning powder.
We know the powder in commercial ammo isn't slow as it must also work in semiautos. And since it has similar bolt speed to some milsurp ammo it within reason to believe the port pressures are the same.
 
Interesting...,I've medalled the last 2 years at Butner in the cmp games matches with....155gr palma bullets and....... IMR4350.
It's a purpose built JCG match rifle, legal in all aspects, and I keep it well greased. I also replace the recoil spring every year.
Knock on wood, lol, but it's never shucked or bent an op rod.
What was your powder charge of 4350?
 
What was your powder charge of 4350?
I doubt if you could put enough IMR 4350 in the case to build enough pressure to do damage with such a light bullet as the 155 grainer, using a 200 grainer with that powder at normal pressures will cause problems. Stay with 4895 and 3031 for a happy Garand.
 
I doubt if you could put enough IMR 4350 in the case to build enough pressure to do damage with such a light bullet as the 155 grainer, using a 200 grainer with that powder at normal pressures will cause problems. Stay with 4895 and 3031 for a happy Garand.
Actually...56.0 of 4350 behind a M2 bullet generated some of the fastest oprod velocity with a MV of @2830fps. So yes...a charge of 4350 and a 150grn bullet CAN generate higher bolt speed than similar velocity using different powders.
 
(This is my load, I take no responsibility for anyone else who tries it)

Garand gets 54gr w/155 Sierra Palma in LC Match case. I'm careful not to get them mixed with the 58gr 4350 under a 168 SMK I shoot in my Vintage Sniper M1903. I wouldn't want to try that in an M1
 
(This is my load, I take no responsibility for anyone else who tries it)

Garand gets 54gr w/155 Sierra Palma in LC Match case. I'm careful not to get them mixed with the 58gr 4350 under a 168 SMK I shoot in my Vintage Sniper M1903. I wouldn't want to try that in an M1
Next test I run I may try that to see the difference in bolt speed between 2.0 grn of powder.
 
I have heard but do not know whether it is true or not that the slower burning powders have peak pressure later than do faster burning powders. This might cause the pressure to be higher than desired when the bolt is trying to unlock and cause the op rod to be pushing against a bolt that is unable to unlock when it should because of the pressure remaining in the chamber. The pressure may not be any higher but would linger long enough to be a problem.

With the gas port so close to the muzzle on a Garand, it would seem as if this would not be a problem, but it has been suggested and is worth considering.
 
Using commercial ammo, what is the speed of the bolt at the moment it strikes the rear of the receiver? Also, what initial acceleration does the op-rod experience under the same conditions?
Ideally the bolt isn't striking the receiver and without putting a gauge back there we don't know if it is or isn't.

In testing HXP 69 and Hornady 150grn superformance the initial travel of the first inch of movement was both basically the same at ~ 27.7 fps. Lots of M2 ball was slower...with this HXP being the fastest.
 
Actually...56.0 of 4350 behind a M2 bullet generated some of the fastest oprod velocity with a MV of @2830fps. So yes...a charge of 4350 and a 150grn bullet CAN generate higher bolt speed than similar velocity using different powders.
My bad, I checked Hodgdon's data and you can get some pretty high pressures with that bullet and powder. My pick is still IMR 4895 and 3031 for a happy Garand.
 
Regarding .30 surplus ball for M1s: Beware of Korean KA headstamp, specifically 73: it is corrosive. Some lots of PS 1970s headstamp Korean ball has hairline cracks down the side of the case and into the primer pocket. The case head will fail and you'll have a split stock and splinters in your hand. The crack is evident in bright sunlight. Not all PS 70s ball has this issue but there were definitely some bad lots reported. It may still be in circulation. Some Austrian OJP ball has the same issue. I'd avoid it. Also French .30 ball with a 'double crimp', another base failure waiting to happen. I've seen all of the failures I mentioned here.

Danish .30 ball, even though not reloadable is very accurate. I've never found a bad lot of the stuff.
 
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What is the band that's missing circled in the pic called?
 

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I have some USGI M72 30-06 MATCH ammo that was loaded by Lake City in 1963.It is what was issued to shoot in Match grade M1 Garands. I highly recommend it.

Saw some on a website for $1.00 per round.
 
M72 was pretty good ammo for a FMJ bullet. Shooting 2MOA @ 600yds with an M1 and M72 was not unheard of.

Nowadays just substitute a Sierra 175gr MK over 46gr of IMR4895 with a Federal 201M primer, and you have a good Garand-safe, M72-clone moving around 2650 fps.
 
My HRA match rifle just loves HXP '76 and shoots most HXP like a laser. And for whatever reasons, it HATES the 167 gn Creedmoor ammo and will not group it worth a crap. And speaking of not grouping worth a crap, it is time for me to get off my ass and start prepping for Butner...
 
Nice! I like seeing the non-traditional rifles on the line. And I would love to see them allow SVT's to compete as vintage.

But I have unfinished business with the Garand. I choked a last shot miss on a wind gust (standing) for a 260 last year, and the cutoff for bronze was 261! I gotta redeem myself this year. I have been dry firing with the drill rifle, but it is about time to start some live firing some from standing. I usually throw up a 12" diameter plate at 200 and run about 20 rounds each session. This year, I also plan on doing some load development, just to see if I can improve on the results I get from HXP.
 
Nice! I like seeing the non-traditional rifles on the line. And I would love to see them allow SVT's to compete as vintage.
Oh you can use the SVT...you just compete as "modern" and you go against brand new AR15s....with optics....which is funny as the SVTis listed a "vintage" sniper rifle...but "modern military" when used with iron sights.

I've been pushing for a "foreign military bolt and gas gun match)...Mark doesn't seem to interested...it's funny as we are setup for 10 relays and usually end up with 6...so PLENTY of room to have an additional match...and CMP would LOVE the entry fee....you would think...
 
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