357 Maximum - Brass and data question

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spittinfire

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So over the weekend I finally dusted off the press and got my 357 Max dies adjusted to start making a few tests to try out in the rifle that's been in my safe for at least a year. If I'm lucky I'll get to try it during rifle season this year.
I've always liked H110 in my magnums handguns and since I've got it on hand I thought I would try it in the Max. I've found a few recipes for it online but I was hoping someone might have an older load manual that would be willing to share what was published in years past as there is not much listed currently. Anyone else reload for this round?


How much has brass changed over the years? I'm using unfired Winchester brass that's fairly old, I'm guessing 80s, but I'm not sure exactly how old. They required more lube then any other brass I've used since I started reloading 10 years ago. Also, the brass felt very stiff as it passed through the sizing die.
 
Tagged.
I can get some crazy velocities from my 357 handi and 77/357 rooga in 357 mag.

I've often wondered what 357 Max would do. I've considered reaming the handi out.

I like H110/296 also but not for the heavier stuff. (158gr +)
For those, in a rifle, lil gun is amazing.
 
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Check over in Graybeard Outdoors. Look in the Handi-Rifle section. Lots of guys have reamed from Maggie to Maxi....
 
Slacker said:
Tagged.
I can get some crazy velocities from my 357 handi and 77/357 rooga in 357 mag.

I've often wondered what 357 Max would do. I've considered reaming the handi out.

I like H110/296 also but not for the heavier stuff. (158gr +)
For those, in a rifle, lil gun is amazing.
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Mine is an H&R that was factory chambered in 357 Max. It took me a little while to find it but I'm glad I did. I plan to start loading 180gr XTPs and go from there.
 
spittinfire said:
Mine is an H&R that was factory chambered in 357 Max. It took me a little while to find it but I'm glad I did. I plan to start loading 180gr XTPs and go from there.
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Try 35 rem rifle bullets.
Specifically the speer deep curl 180gr.
I think the XTP's max velocity is a bit low for the Max.
 
The 357 Max is one cartridge that looks very interesting to me. I load for a 16" 357mag lever gun, and I get good velocity and accuracy with 158gn XTP and 300-MP powder. I have not seen a published load for 300-MP in 357 Max, though. I would be very tempted to work up loads for it, starting with 357mag charges.
 
Slacker said:
Try 35 rem rifle bullets.
Specifically the speer deep curl 180gr.
I think the XTP's max velocity is a bit low for the Max.
Click to expand...

I'm a fan of Deep Curls but couldn't find anything heavier than 158gr. I've had good results from them and XTPs so with the XTP available in 180gr I decided to go that route.

I might start playing with rifle bullets down the road but for now I just want to make smoke and loading pistol bullets is easier.
 
I used to shoot quite a bit of 357 Max when I was fooling with metallic silhouette. I don't recall the loads right off hand so I'll need to consult my records before I could give you anything concrete. I do recall a Speer 185 grain SP that I used in some Ram loads.
 
I've been interested in this caliber for a long time. The maximum in a Handi would be a compact little deer hammer.
 
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4227 seems to be popular for the Max. Don't have a Max (yet), but have been lusting after a 10.5" SBH .357Max for a while.
 
I may be coming into possession of a .357Max soon & have been doing some digging online. Seems like 4227 is kind of the default powder for 180gr & 200gr, while 1680 will push those same bullets even faster & 2400 does well under 158gr. Consensus also seems to be that H110/W296 will work but isn't recommended for max velocity as it can get twitchy at those pressures & can't reach the velocity that a slower powder like 1680 will. All 2nd hand info, but much of it from former silhouette shooters & those dudes needed both precision & max velocity.
 
Crazy Carl said:
I may be coming into possession of a .357Max soon & have been doing some digging online. Seems like 4227 is kind of the default powder for 180gr & 200gr, while 1680 will push those same bullets even faster & 2400 does well under 158gr. Consensus also seems to be that H110/W296 will work but isn't recommended for max velocity as it can get twitchy at those pressures & can't reach the velocity that a slower powder like 1680 will. All 2nd hand info, but much of it from former silhouette shooters & those dudes needed both precision & max velocity.
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I'm suprised no mention of lil gun.
I bet it works well with the heavies in a rifle length barrel.
 
Don't know why it wouldn't work. I've got some 4227 & a bunch of 2400 on hand, but I'm gonna pick up some more 4227 & some 1680 as well.
 
Well, I won an auction for a 10.5" .357Max Super Blackhawk. I've got 500pcs of new Starline brass, 200 gas checked 200gr LWNs, 2000 CCI small rifle primers, 2lbs of 4227 & 2lbs of 1680 on the way & have 158gr & 180gr JHP, 178gr LSWC & 180gr LWFN on hand.

As I'm able to load some up & hit the range, I'll post up recipes & chrony data if anyone's interested.
 
Slacker said:
I'm suprised no mention of lil gun.
I bet it works well with the heavies in a rifle length barrel.
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I was thinking the same thing of 300-MP, but can't say that I have seen any load data for 357max. I get excellent results with it in my 357 and 44 mag rifles.
 
Toprudder said:
I was thinking the same thing of 300-MP, but can't say that I have seen any load data for 357max. I get excellent results with it in my 357 and 44 mag rifles.
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With the huge case capacity of the max, coupled with the locked breach action, it seems wasteful to use it in such a short barrel (10.5").
I may have to ream my handi to max, just to have some data to compare the 16" bbl vs 10.5".
I'll bet the forcing cone gap also gives up some velocity.
I would like to see how a 200gr Speer deep curl (.358) jacketed soft point performs.
 
Slacker said:
With the huge case capacity of the max, coupled with the locked breach action, it seems wasteful to use it in such a short barrel (10.5").
I may have to ream my handi to max, just to have some data to compare the 16" bbl vs 10.5".
I'll bet the forcing cone gap also gives up some velocity.
I would like to see how a 200gr Speer deep curl (.358) jacketed soft point performs.
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With a 5" GP100, I saw no velocity advantage to using 300-MP, it reached a velocity plateau of 1200 fps a good 1.5gn below max charge. I did see an advantage in my 10" 44mag Blackhawk, though.
 
Someone needs to make a cut-down Indiana spec .35 Remington revolver so I can use all that stupid short brass I bought from a guy.
 
Crazy Carl said:
Well, I won an auction for a 10.5" .357Max Super Blackhawk. I've got 500pcs of new Starline brass, 200 gas checked 200gr LWNs, 2000 CCI small rifle primers, 2lbs of 4227 & 2lbs of 1680 on the way & have 158gr & 180gr JHP, 178gr LSWC & 180gr LWFN on hand.

As I'm able to load some up & hit the range, I'll post up recipes & chrony data if anyone's interested.
Click to expand...

I would definitely be interested. To go with the rifle I have I picked up a 14" barrel for my Contender so I really need to get some loads worked up.

I did load up 20 rounds of 180gr XTP over 19gr of H110. I had all the pieces to put that together and I figured it would be a good starting point.
 
From what I've seen the 200+ gr rifle bullets work well in Contenders & revolvers with enough cylinder length (DW & Seville) & the right twist. Apparently pointy bullets are more twist sensitive & like a 1-16" or faster twist.

I'll never be trying to knock over steel rams at 200m, but would like to hunt with it & bang the crap outta steel at 100m.
 
Got my Max dies set up today. I'm gonna be loading the 200gr GCs over 16-18gr of 4227 & see what this beast likes best. Pretty pedestrian load (if you can apply that term to the Max), but I wanna get a good feel for this one before I start playing around. I promise to nerd out with the chrony & post results.
 
When you get to where you want to be send me a handful and I will give you your real time pressures. We do this all the time for several small boutique ammo specialist.
 
While you would be welcome to come anytime, folks mail us stuff all the time. PERSONALLY, I'd rather have your company on this end! Bring anything you wnt checked. We'll make it happen. .357 Max is Way under rated.
 
I've been a 'fan' of the round since first reading about it, 20-odd years ago. Started visitin' singleactions.com several years ago & have been lusting for one ever since. I like everything I've read about it & can't wait to see for myself.

I've always owned at least one .357Mag since I was old enough to buy 'em for myself. I'm attracted to the off-beat & the different & dove head first down the .41Mag rabbit hole, so jumping into .357Max wasn't so big a stretch for me.

I would love a 10.5" Ruger Max converted to .414Gates, but the cost of entry into that game is breathtaking.
 
Finally got to the range today & shot those 200gr GCWFNs over 18.4, 18.9 & 19.3gr of IMR-4227. They all shot very well, with the 19.3gr load giving the best numbers, averaging 1456fps, with a ES of 54 & SD of 18. Primers are just starting to flatten a little, but still very easy extraction.

I was hoping for a bit more velocity, but that's still a pretty stout load & shot well. More of a handful than I expected, but not as stiff as one of my stoked up .41Mags.
 
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