Advice 4 AK Noob

Sniffler

Sniffler

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Good quality wasr is the way to go. The M10 has the one piece gas block/front sight, longer and skinnier barrel sticking out after the sight. Just looks ugly to me. Zastava barrels are not chrome lined, parts are not standard akm.
 
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df0101 said:
Good quality wasr is the way to go. The M10 has the one piece gas block/front sight, longer and skinnier barrel sticking out after the sight. Just looks ugly to me. Zastava barrels are not chrome lined, parts are not standard akm.
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I agree on the M10 barrel/sight block. This is the new Zastava.

Corrosion resistant hard nickel molly steel bolt carrier
  • Stamped receiver 1.5 mm with Bulged trunnion
  • Cold hammer forged barrel Chrome Lined barrel
 
df0101 said:
Good quality wasr is the way to go. The M10 has the one piece gas block/front sight, longer and skinnier barrel sticking out after the sight. Just looks ugly to me. Zastava barrels are not chrome lined, parts are not standard akm.
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the newest Zastava stuff is supposed to be chrome lined
 
My answer would be none of those, and just buy Wade's sweet WASR-10 in the classifieds.

I don't think the M10 Pro is worth the extra money, to be honest. And that red wood looks like Kool-Aid. Atlantic also sells a no-frills M10, and a "DIY" M10 (though not sure what's in stock at the moment) that allows you to customize with your preferred furniture and muzzle device, etc. Either of those will suit you just as fine as the Pro model. And if you're looking at an M10, it's basically a WASR with a combo front sight and gas block . I believe the new WASRs Atlantic has for sale were purchased from a middleman distributor and not directly from Century, so the current prices reflect the (hopefully only temporarily) higher retail prices. So, Wade's rifle for sale continues to be the best deal, in my opinion.

If I had to choose from what you linked, I'd go Zastava. Its newest offerings seem to be good to go, but just know if you want to swap out furniture down the road, you'll have fewer aftermarket options, because Yugo/Serbian guns don't use the same interchangeable parts as many of the other combloc nations. The ZPAPM70 is basically an OPAP with a chrome-lined barrel, and for $829 plus tax, shipping, and transfer, you can probably find an original OPAP for the same price. I'd much rather have the OG, but the M70 is a good choice. Less "proven" since these are all reissues, but again ... hopefully good to go.
 
IUHoosier429 said:
My answer would be none of those, and just buy Wade's sweet WASR-10 in the classifieds.

I don't think the M10 Pro is worth the extra money, to be honest. And that red wood looks like Kool-Aid. Atlantic also sells a no-frills M10, and a "DIY" M10 (though not sure what's in stock at the moment) that allows you to customize with your preferred furniture and muzzle device, etc. Either of those will suit you just as fine as the Pro model. And if you're looking at an M10, it's basically a WASR with a combo front sight and gas block . I believe the new WASRs Atlantic has for sale were purchased from a middleman distributor and not directly from Century, so the current prices reflect the (hopefully only temporarily) higher retail prices. So, Wade's rifle for sale continues to be the best deal, in my opinion.

If I had to choose from what you linked, I'd go Zastava. Its newest offerings seem to be good to go, but just know if you want to swap out furniture down the road, you'll have fewer aftermarket options, because Yugo/Serbian guns don't use the same interchangeable parts as many of the other combloc nations. The ZPAPM70 is basically an OPAP with a chrome-lined barrel, and for $829 plus tax, shipping, and transfer, you can probably find an original OPAP for the same price. I'd much rather have the OG, but the M70 is a good choice. Less "proven" since these are all reissues, but again ... hopefully good to go.
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Wade's WASR is cool. :cool:

The synthetic stock M10 isn't as garish as the red laminate.
 
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charliesgrave said:
When in doubt, buy a WASR. For best results, inspect it first or have someone who knows what they're looking for do it for you.

Rule of thumb for AK's is that imports are generally better than US made, stay away from Century made or IO rifles altogether. I wouldn't trust Riley Defense either.

Zastava is living on past glory. The rifles they made that were used in the Balkans conflicts were excellent. even some older imports several decades back like the 5.56 rifles were pretty nice. Their new stuff is commercially produced, and they've had some QC problems on older batches with heat treat and fit and finish. Can't really speak to their latest imports, but they're overpriced IMHO.

The M10 rifles are fine, but have shorter sight radius, sometimes tight mag catch, and no standard detent for muzzle brakes. The rear sight notch is also a little shallow for my eyes, but nothing a small file wouldn't fix.

I'd find a WASR, Mak, or buy a WBP.

Stay away from Romanian SAR1's. They're horrible, awful rifles, and if you find one cheap, point me to it so I can save someone some heartache.
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Good info. Thank you. I have looked at the WBP rifles and have heard good things. Off to look again.
 
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Sniffler said:
Wade's WASR is cool. :cool:

The synthetic stock M10 isn't as garish as the red laminate.
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Agreed about the synthetic stock. And two things worth noting about the M10 and newer Century guns in general: 1) the non-laminate "hardwood" on WASRs, RH10s, AES-10Bs, and the new PSL handguards is garbage. I think it's made out of the same stuff as those little unassembled balsa gliders you buy at Cracker Barrel. If you end up with any of these guns, I'd kindly suggest to buy some replacement furniture and toss this stuff in your next bonfire. And 2) not sure if the Century M10s still have this issue, but the older M10 rifles imported by M+M Industries (which was later sued by the great folks at Century) featured a side rail that sits about a quarter inch higher than standard AKs, which means your optics will, too. RS Regulate makes a fantastic optics mount for the M10, RH10, and PSL that compensates for this.
 
Sniffler said:
Good info. Thank you. I have looked at the WPB rifles and have heard good things. Off to look again.
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Oh now it's getting interesting! If you're open to other options, this thread's sure to grow. Also, I should have asked before but what is your budget for your next AK, and are you set on only buying new guns?

I feel this meme is warranted again considering @Sniffler's new addiction :cool: Welcome to the club. I'm IU Hoosier, and I'm an AKaholic.

G0b1wxDl.jpg
 
IUHoosier429 said:
Oh now it's getting interesting! If you're open to other options, this thread's sure to grow. Also, I should have asked before but what is your budget for your next AK, and are you set on only buying new guns?

I feel this meme is warranted again considering @Sniffler's new addiction :cool: Welcome to the club. I'm IU Hoosier, and I'm an AKaholic.

G0b1wxDl.jpg
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I'm leaning toward new guns mostly because I believe it helps lessen the chance of a stupid mistake on my part. As far as budget I would LIKE to stay at or under $1000.00.

We all know how that goes.

ETA: If I don't spend 1k I'm good with it. Also I'm not in a huge rush. I want to make a smart choice and this ain't nothin' like buying ARs.
 
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I love the Serb rifles. I think it's funny they switched to the RPK trunnion and 1.5mm receiver to make the rifles more durable while shooting grenades in the M70B1's but then they took off that function by removing the shut off gas block but still kept the RPK trunnion in the ZPAP. It's a lot of extra weight for no real benefit.

Sniffler, what's your main purpose for the rifle. Home defense, trunk gun, range toy, fighting carbine? If you have a CCW, then maybe a pistol style AKM with a brace might work better so you can carry it loaded in your vehicle.
 
digitalpaladin10 said:
Sniffler, what's your main purpose for the rifle. Home defense, trunk gun, range toy, fighting carbine? If you have a CCW, then maybe a pistol style AKM with a brace might work better so you can carry it loaded in your vehicle.
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Those are some nice rifles you have sir.

I'm not a fan of the AR/AK pistols. I like them I've just never felt inclined to own one. I have a Glock 19 and a S&W J frame 38. Age and progressive bifocals have diminished my pistol skills somewhat.
As far as a rifle I'm not nor never will be a collector. I like a rifle that will serve as all of the above. I usually have a rifle in the truck with me when I go somewhere. From home defense to hog hunting in Florida and everything in between is a possibility.
 
If you want it to do all that then I'd make sure it can accept a good combat rated light and an optic. Are you wanting your rifle to keep the wood hand guards and stock or will you accept something more modern looking? Modern furniture will give you more flexibility in your accessories.
 
Thanks, but I'm not trying to sell you one of my rifles. :)

A set up like this would let you use glass for hog hunting and then remove it to use just the iron sights. I wouldn't use that optics set up though. You can put a 7.62x39 BDC'd scope, like this one, in low profile rings and still get a cheek weld. Any rifle you might ever use in a fight should have a light. There are many options for getting a light on the AK type rifle. Just don't compromise on the barrel, hammer forged and chromed-lined.

wbp%20ak47%20beryl_-25.jpg
 
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I'm gonna buck the trend and say AK-E mainly because FN's barrels are par excellence, and since you already have a GF3 you know they're not making junk unlike just about every other American made AK widely available.
And you've already said you're not a collector.
 
Right now everything good is out of stock. Atlantic says the WBP Fox is currently in production and should be in stock around the end of June. Same for the PSA 103 Klone and God knows when the AKE will be back in stock.
The new Zastava is sold out. If everything shows up at once the Fox gets the nod. It seems that is the best rifle for the money hands down.
Of course if something cool shows up before then I may impulse buy. I'm like a cat after a red dot. :(
 
Sniffler said:
Right now everything good is out of stock. Atlantic says the WBP Fox is currently in production and should be in stock around the end of June. Same for the PSA 103 Klone and God knows when the AKE will be back in stock.
The new Zastava is sold out. If everything shows up at once the Fox gets the nod. It seems that is the best rifle for the money hands down.
Of course if something cool shows up before then I may impulse buy. I'm like a cat after a red dot. :(
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I just took a stroll through Atlantic's website. Looks like the WASR-10 went up even more in price sometime this week. $850 now :confused: That's less than $100 away from some of WBP's offerings. Crazy times we're in. If you want to roll your own, some of Atlantic's DIY kits are back in stock.

You can sign up on PSA's website for in-stock email notifications and try to grab an AK-E the next time they're back. From my experience with PSA though, the notification system never worked and restocked items usually sold out within minutes. YMMV, but the trick is to check PSA's multiple times a day, every day, if you have the time and energy.
 
The WASRs have gone crazy. The one for $849 supposedly has a better grade of furniture. PSAs notification system is not to spiffy. I'm on it though, also Atlantic for two different WBP Foxes and the new Zastava M70.
PSA posted a picture of the 103 Klone awhile ago on FB. No comments from them, just pic.
 
Sniffler said:
The WASRs have gone crazy. The one for $849 supposedly has a better grade of furniture.
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Ah, I just realized Atlantic has two WASR-10 variants posted:
I'll all but guarantee both models come with that matchstick hardwood furniture. Atlantic mentions the RI1805 may come with laminate or a mixture of laminate and hardwood, but I'd bet a surplus Romy dong that 99 out of 100 rifles are all hardwood.
 
There's been a lot of hate for American AK's, and rightfully so. Most all American AK's are terrible, if you want a good AK, you had to go European.

But as was mentioned, the psa ak-e, and the kalashnikov-usa AK , should both be excellent.

I know AK Operators Union loves the AK-E.
 
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There's also NC-born Riley Defense, which I've never had any interest in and would never recommend to anyone...

...until Rob's recent video about their alleged incoming AK-74. Riley almost seems like the fat kid on your high school track team, who no one gave a crap about but who somehow found this fantastic burst of energy and may beat everyone's hero PSA across the 5.45 finish line.

I still can't recommend them but am definitely intrigued by this new offering. If the Riley 74 is even mostly what it's cracked up to be, I might roll the dice and nab one.
 
IUHoosier429 said:
There's also NC-born Riley Defense, which I've never had any interest in and would never recommend to anyone...

...until Rob's recent video about their alleged incoming AK-74. Riley almost seems like the fat kid on your high school track team, who no one gave a crap about but who somehow found this fantastic burst of energy and may beat everyone's hero PSA across the 5.45 finish line.

I still can't recommend them but am definitely intrigued by this new offering. If the Riley 74 is even mostly what it's cracked up to be, I might roll the dice and nab one.
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I've met the president. Of Riley arms. And I ran one of his rifles through hell and back using all sorts of terrible ammo, mags and the like. I'm talking bullets that were literally falling apart in some cases and others feeling like almost a magnum load.

The man believes in his product, trusted enough in his heat treating to have a 400lb man jump on his rifle without a bolt in it to prove the strength. He stands by it more than I see in a lot of places nowadays. Now is it perfect? No. They are a small company and are bound to have some growing pains. I still prefer the newer wasr10 rifles for the most part, but everything I have seen of the Reilly arms function wise in the last few years has been quite solid.
 
Hungarian aks can be had for a decent price if you find one. They are decent but tend to lack a following it seems.

If you know what to look for you can try to track down a decent waffenwerks. They were built off of Bulgarian kits, like the arsenals and the ones with nodak receivers were quite nice. The ones with in house receivers were quite spotty towards the end though. Kinda like the old 94 ban era wasr rifles
 
shadowsbane said:
I've met the president. Of Riley arms. And I ran one of his rifles through hell and back using all sorts of terrible ammo, mags and the like. I'm talking bullets that were literally falling apart in some cases and others feeling like almost a magnum load.

The man believes in his product, trusted enough in his heat treating to have a 400lb man jump on his rifle without a bolt in it to prove the strength. He stands by it more than I see in a lot of places nowadays. Now is it perfect? No. They are a small company and are bound to have some growing pains. I still prefer the newer wasr10 rifles for the most part, but everything I have seen of the Reilly arms function wise in the last few years has been quite solid.
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Nice to see you back over here. Can you shed any more light on this experience? What was the setting for your testing? Which Riley model? How many rounds? Any failures or other issues/hiccups? What happened to the gun afterwards?

Every company goes through growing pains, and some simply don't recover from them. Kudos to Riley for hanging in there through some pretty legitimately problematic and questionable times. They used to use a vendor for heat treated parts - is that still the case? Where do their receivers come from? Also, depending on where someone - regardless of belt size - jumps on an AKM receiver (i.e. trunnions) it will be fine, bolt or no bolt. Also, I'm hoping this feat occurred while it was on its side :p

I'll second your suggestion about Hungarians. We don't hear much about Hungarian AKs, but FEG-stamped guns never seem to stay for sale for long. There seems to be enough folks in the know who snatch them up, especially at fair prices.
 
IUHoosier429 said:
Nice to see you back over here. Can you shed any more light on this experience? What was the setting for your testing? Which Riley model? How many rounds? Any failures or other issues/hiccups? What happened to the gun afterwards?

Every company goes through growing pains, and some simply don't recover from them. Kudos to Riley for hanging in there through some pretty legitimately problematic and questionable times. They used to use a vendor for heat treated parts - is that still the case? Where do their receivers come from? Also, depending on where someone - regardless of belt size - jumps on an AKM receiver (i.e. trunnions) it will be fine, bolt or no bolt. Also, I'm hoping this feat occurred while it was on its side :p

I'll second your suggestion about Hungarians. We don't hear much about Hungarian AKs, but FEG-stamped guns never seem to stay for sale for long. There seems to be enough folks in the know who snatch them up, especially at fair prices.
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Wow lots of questions

Let's see

Model I shot was the rak47 with synthetic furniture.
Between me and another guy put about 750 to 900 rounds through it.
Had 4 or 5 failures to feed. All the same magazine which was some super cheap Korean steel one. Tapco and pmags worked fine.

Ammo used was hornady, tula, wolf, and a fair amount of really terrible corroded Romanian surplus ammo I had stashed away. That is the stuff that was falling apart.

Accuracy was decent, but I never benched it to see for exact numbers. I was focused on reliability and evidence of bolt, hammer, and other wear that would indicate safety issues. This was December of 2018. And the ak op union review was still making the rounds. There was nothing but some slight finish wear on the bolt assembly.

The gun was sent back them after testing.

The jumping on the receiver was bolt out jump on middle where it is nice and hollow throw bolt assembly back in then check to see how it didn't bind. It is admittedly a chintzy way to make a point, and I wouldn't reccomend it, but it was an effective visual. Also it feels like the dust cover is also heat treated cause they are crazy stiff, and really don't bend at all, unlike century products .

Just so we are clear, I don't work for or represent the company on any sort of official, or unofficial basis. So I don't know most of the inner workings of the company, But I do believe that they used to get bolts and barrel blanks from a different source than they do now.
 
Thanks for all that, @shadowsbane. Good to have more firsthand information like this. It's easy to pile on the AKOU scrum or join the Reddit warriors when crap happens, but the vast majority of those folks have never owned, shot, or even handled a Riley AK. So this is helpful and interesting info.
 
It won't be my last AK but I did order a rifle this morning. It may be a mistake but I figured why not. I like the features and the look. Also it should hold me over until the PSA 103 Klone comes out. It also stopped me from paying $1750 for a Rifle Dynamics RD-701 I found on consignment yesterday. :eek:

The new hotness:

Zastava ZPAP M70 1.5mm

(photo shamelessly stolen)

S9eZYcZ.jpg
 
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