Anyone near CLT a good DA shooter

GymB

Picking it up slowly.
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I bought a DAO Sig P220 in 45acp. I like the feel of the gun, but mostly I’m too stubborn to let it beat me.

I was shooting so poorly with it that I actually bought a new barrel...it didn’t help.

And yet I still don’t believe that it is me.

So, if your a good DA shooter near me I’d love to loan you the gun and see how well you shoot it. I’ll provide the factory ammo, or if you like your reloads that’s cool too.

Who wants to take a crack at it?
Jim
 
I consider myself to be a better than normal DA shooter since I came from the revolver era. I still have several K frame Smiths that I only shoot DA and enjoy the feat. Maybe yours is not a match grade DA and you need to look at something else that better suits you..
 
I'd start little dry fire routine. With my CZ's I place a coin on the barrel, and aim at a small target across the room. Sometimes I tape up a post it note with a dot on it, but anything small will work. Try at least 10-15 minutes a day. Keep the front sight stable and the coil on the slide.

All that being said I had a Sig I couldn't shoot worth a damn. Even in SA. Let another member here and his wife try it, and they tore up the center of the target. Sold the Sig and moved on.
 
I consider myself to be a better than normal DA shooter since I came from the revolver era. I still have several K frame Smiths that I only shoot DA and enjoy the feat. Maybe yours is not a match grade DA and you need to look at something else that better suits you..
It is a service grade p220, so not match grade, but I’m too stubborn, can’t stop trying to make it shoot better. I’m gonna take a K frame to the range today and compare results.

I'd start little dry fire routine. With my CZ's I place a coin on the barrel, and aim at a small target across the room. Sometimes I tape up a post it note with a dot on it, but anything small will work. Try at least 10-15 minutes a day. Keep the front sight stable and the coil on the slide.

All that being said I had a Sig I couldn't shoot worth a damn. Even in SA. Let another member here and his wife try it, and they tore up the center of the target. Sold the Sig and moved on.
This is a good way to practice and it helps to build finger strength.
 
Is it a true DAO or a DAK?
Try using the joint of your finger rather than the pad. I got better results that way with my P220 DAK before I sold it.

You could always convert it to DA/SA.
 
I thought DA meant Distrct Attorney.
Well, I’ve been working on upper body strength, but so far the District Attorney is far to political to keep pointed in any one direction for any period of time.

Is it a true DAO or a DAK?
Try using the joint of your finger rather than the pad. I got better results that way with my P220 DAK before I sold it.

You could always convert it to DA/SA.
It is DAO. I’ve been thinking about converting it, but I want to learn to shoot it well...if it can be done. Will try the joint tonight with dry fire and when I get to the range next.

I have known 2 men in my life that could shoot better than a stock gun is capable of 2...
I know lots, but then I also have experience with some really poorly performing stock guns. I get your point though, which I had a rest I could put it in.
 
Well, I’ve been working on upper body strength, but so far the District Attorney is far to political to keep pointed in any one direction for any period of time.


It is DAO. I’ve been thinking about converting it, but I want to learn to shoot it well...if it can be done. Will try the joint tonight with dry fire and when I get to the range next.


I know lots, but then I also have experience with some really poorly performing stock guns. I get your point though, which I had a rest I could put it in.
If you know lots of folks that can out shoot a stock handgun from a Ransom Rest, you are indeed in high cotton. Bring it with you in October, we'll put it in the RR.
 
If you know lots of folks that can out shoot a stock handgun from a Ransom Rest, you are indeed in high cotton. Bring it with you in October, we'll put it in the RR.
Sir, if you have the inserts for a P220 I’m happy to ship it to you!
 
If you will bring it I will promise you I'll have them. You don't have to wait until Oct. Just let me know, we can make it happen.
 
Quick thought..by the time you pay an FFL to ship, and ship Priority, and pay again to send it back. You could aquire the inserts and come over. Glad to help but let's save as much money as possible. The RR is sitting here ready to go.
 
Quick thought..by the time you pay an FFL to ship, and ship Priority, and pay again to send it back. You could aquire the inserts and come over. Glad to help but let's save as much money as possible. The RR is sitting here ready to go.
Sure an FFL is required for this kinda shipment? Since ownership isn't changing, isn't it like sending a gun back to the factory for repair?
 
Sure an FFL is required for this kinda shipment? Since ownership isn't changing, isn't it like sending a gun back to the factory for repair?
For sure it would require express shipment, so probably better to spend the money on the inserts and make a day of it.
 
I know lots, but then I also have experience with some really poorly performing stock guns. I get your point though, which I had a rest I could put it in.

If the gun isn't malfunctioning, it's you. I don't mean that to be rude or anything, but new equipment and all that rarely solves a problem. I look at this way, if it was the only gun I had, what would I do? My M&P 9C was a pain for me to get consistent with. In the end, instead of getting rid of it, I figured it out.
 
I bought a DAO Sig P220 in 45acp. I like the feel of the gun, but mostly I’m too stubborn to let it beat me.

I was shooting so poorly with it that I actually bought a new barrel...it didn’t help.

And yet I still don’t believe that it is me.

So, if your a good DA shooter near me I’d love to loan you the gun and see how well you shoot it. I’ll provide the factory ammo, or if you like your reloads that’s cool too.

Who wants to take a crack at it?
Jim

Do you have any other DAO pistols or revolvers to compare?

If you can punch the center out with the others but not this one, then it might not be the gun but it's not the gun for you...
 
instead of getting rid of it, I figured it out
I did this many years ago with Glocks. Sent to Robar for grip reduction, tried everything I knew to do...nothing helped. Then I bought Advantage Arms .22 conversions for the Big and Medium Glocks and went to work. Several 1,000s of rounds later I had it whipped. The RR will only confirm that that thing will shoot Knots at 10-15 and a couple of inches at 25. I too was trying not to be rude, most folks don't want to hear it's not the gun. Folks want to buy some proficiency , new sights, new barrel, new grips. I once kept a 45 acp barrel that had the chamber deepened to take 45 Win Mags and then went forward and stripped all the lands and grooves out. I did this to shoot shot shells in the acp, but it was great to show folks. This barrel only headspaced on the extractor and had NO lands and grooves in it. Anybody that could halfway shoot regularly shot head shots with it at 15 yards. Sometime guns just don't "fit" you. It has been my observation that it is usually better to get another platform. Also, at what distance are you shooting and what groups are you getting. DAOs don't usually lend themselves well to groups, NOT because the platform isn't capable but because of the inherent difficulty of trigger control.
 
You guys suck, now I’m all triggered and whatnot.

Actually I like the idea of slapping a 22 conversion on it...or I could just sell it and stay with the 226 in 9mm and 1911s in .45.

Tweaked up my back yesterday reloading .45 so no shooting for at least a few days, but going to compare DA revolver to this and see what I get. Did get the gun cleaned last night and will keep at the dry fire.

FWIW, groups were tighter the other day than they were a couple weeks ago, this is obously because he gun is getting broken in and nothing to do with me;-)
 
Although all my guns are light SA triggers or glocks, my favorite guns to shoot are DA Revos.

Because they are challenging and if you can shoot one well it is very satisfying.

I sure wish I could take a crack at the Sig!!
 
I did this many years ago with Glocks. Sent to Robar for grip reduction, tried everything I knew to do...nothing helped. Then I bought Advantage Arms .22 conversions for the Big and Medium Glocks and went to work. Several 1,000s of rounds later I had it whipped. The RR will only confirm that that thing will shoot Knots at 10-15 and a couple of inches at 25. I too was trying not to be rude, most folks don't want to hear it's not the gun. Folks want to buy some proficiency , new sights, new barrel, new grips. I once kept a 45 acp barrel that had the chamber deepened to take 45 Win Mags and then went forward and stripped all the lands and grooves out. I did this to shoot shot shells in the acp, but it was great to show folks. This barrel only headspaced on the extractor and had NO lands and grooves in it. Anybody that could halfway shoot regularly shot head shots with it at 15 yards. Sometime guns just don't "fit" you. It has been my observation that it is usually better to get another platform. Also, at what distance are you shooting and what groups are you getting. DAOs don't usually lend themselves well to groups, NOT because the platform isn't capable but because of the inherent difficulty of trigger control.

This^^^^^^^

The DA trigger really lends itself to "disturbing the sights", resulting in sub-par groups. It is up to the shooter to overcome and adapt. Less disturbing of the sights in your trigger work (and grip) should yield in better groups.
 
Learn to “hard prep” the trigger.
 
Learn to “hard prep” the trigger.

Not sure what this means, care to asplain?

Did some double action shooting today with a variety of guns, shot two 5 shot uninterrupted strings with each gun at 30’, measured only the second group.
S&W 64 2” barrel - 2.54”
S&W 10-6, 4” barrel - 2.41”
CZ 75b - 1.57”
Sig P220 - 2.19”

Then to test .223 loads from my stock S&W M&P15 w/ 4x ACOG at 75’.
5 shot groups Hornady 55g FMJBT over 23.5g Accurate 2470 - .19”, .50”, and .35”
10 shot groups Butter’s 55g FMJ over 24.1g Hodgdon H335 - 1.19”, 1.38”, 1.35”

For double action shooting, more practice.
For the rifle going to increase charge of H335 to see if it’ll tighten up, then head outdoors to shoot at a more reasonable distance.
 
Not sure what this means, care to asplain?

Did some double action shooting today with a variety of guns, shot two 5 shot uninterrupted strings with each gun at 30’, measured only the second group.
S&W 64 2” barrel - 2.54”
S&W 10-6, 4” barrel - 2.41”
CZ 75b - 1.57”
Sig P220 - 2.19”

Then to test .223 loads from my stock S&W M&P15 w/ 4x ACOG at 75’.
5 shot groups Hornady 55g FMJBT over 23.5g Accurate 2470 - .19”, .50”, and .35”
10 shot groups Butter’s 55g FMJ over 24.1g Hodgdon H335 - 1.19”, 1.38”, 1.35”

For double action shooting, more practice.
For the rifle going to increase charge of H335 to see if it’ll tighten up, then head outdoors to shoot at a more reasonable distance.

Watch this video from Jerry of OpSpec Training. He talks about the difference between a "controled slap" vs a "hard prep". He is shoot a DA/SA trigger but it applies to DAO gun as well.



Basically what you are doing is taking the slack out of the trigger as the gun as you are presenting it or it is cycling. If you P220 has a 9lb DAO trigger as you are presenting the gun or as it is cycling you are taking 5-7 pounds out of that trigger as you are presenting the gun. In one smooth motion you are pulling through the DAO trigger as your sights are aligned. This will make your press a lot smoother and when done correctly results in better targets. As BatteryOaksBill stated the long nature of a DAO pull allows time and distance for the shooter to introduce errors which influence the sight picture as one pulls the trigger.

What most people do with a DAO gun is present the gun. Get the sights on target in alignment and then start to press the trigger. This results in jerking the sights out of alignment because of the time. length and weight of the trigger. By aggressively hard prepping the trigger as you are presenting the gun as your sights come into alignment you are not starting the long pull you are finishing it. You cannot do this with a 1911 or SA gun but to me it is the advantage of the DAO or even DA/SA platform. Ernest Langdon illustrates this in a few videos I linked to below.

This really helps with more dynamic shooting but it is also applicable to shooting static targets trying to achieve good groups. With a DAO P220 you just have to make sure that you let the trigger all the way out so you don't short stroke it. Sig developed the DAK trigger which has 2 reset points to allow shooters to hard prep a DAO gun. When I ran a lot of DA/SA guns I worked on this concept a lot. It helps with the DA/SA transition. Also let me state for the record I am not a "good" DA shooter. I can shoot them OK and understand the concepts and the skills one needs to shoot them well but there is a reason I like SAO guns like 1911, BHPs and CZs. LOL

Take a look at these videos from Ernest Langdon he recommends a more fluid pull in a smooth consistent manner in the first video.



In these videos on presentation he is using more of a "hard prep". When he is taking about being "Aggressive" on the trigger.



 
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I like to think of pulling the DA trigger like I am stroking the paddle on a canoe. Smooth straight through press with no prep.
I then reset the trigger with exactly the same tempo and smooth stroke, only backwards. So that the whole in and out process is as seemless and smooth as possible.
I rely on my weak hand (actually the most important hand in pistol shooting and should be called strong hand, imo) to keep gun aligned and steady with hard grip pressure.

I sometimes stage or prep a DA trigger for slow long accurate shots. But not usually. Just my non expert opinion.
 
Thanks guys, good ideas.
 
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