Apprently the GRNC rally got some attention from Wral.
http://www.wral.com/rhinos-give-gun-rights-banner-to-senate-rino-berger/16857853/
http://www.wral.com/rhinos-give-gun-rights-banner-to-senate-rino-berger/16857853/
GRNC gets WRAL coverage
- Thread starter Radar
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That's exactly what I was thinking. Then two guys show up on the news dressed in furry suits. Had we known that CFF could have sent @RedneckFur as representation. His fur suits are much more professional looking, not cheap and shoddy like these two guys.
T
trcubed
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Good grief. That isn't the kind of representation I consider professional or appropriate. In fact, it's downright laughable. Whose idea was it to dress two grown men up as rhinos?
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Evidently it was GRNC's: https://www.carolinafirearmsforum.c...8-02-17-gun-group-to-lampoon-gop-rinos.12423/
(That's the second announcement they posted...after the first that was linked earlier in this thread).
T
trcubed
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I agree. I guess I was wondering who in GRNC vetted this...Paul, the guys in the rhino suits, someone else?
Gives a new meaning to rino-site-us. lol
T
trcubed
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More importantly, the legislature and the uninformed public can't take GRNC seriously with stunts like that.
Mad Dawg
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Agree!! You should dress for the job you want. Perception, most of the time is reality to a lot of people. GRNC should have vetted those in attendance before the rally.
Well, I'm so glad that everyone commenting on this contributed to the GRNC effort. It was also good to see everyone come out and let the legislature know exactly how you feel about their dragging their feet on H746... Oh... you weren't there or you would not be asking about attendance...
Good job gun community!
I expect that GRNC would gladly accept donation of a high quality "RINO" rhino mascot costume. Who will step up to help? GRNC will likely need it for many upcoming events.
Yes - street theater is a stunt. Not it's not "professional". It's done purely to get attention. Politicians and the press have unfortunately been conditioned to these kind of antics.
Months of careful and professional influence by a number of volunteers dressed in well tailored business suits have been ineffective with our Senate, people that appear to have forgotten who brought them to the dance.
How many of those impotently complaining here wrote a paper letter to their senator about the bill? How about even a phone call? Let's see the community dedication...
I know that it was too hot for many people to show up out there and stand in the sun with a gun rights sign, but a number of people drove to Raleigh and did just that. Many people on our side (unlike the strident anti-gun zealots) actually have jobs and work during the week. Many people attending took the day off work to attend.
Again - thanks for the constructive contributions here. Let's see what comes next...
Good job gun community!
I expect that GRNC would gladly accept donation of a high quality "RINO" rhino mascot costume. Who will step up to help? GRNC will likely need it for many upcoming events.
Yes - street theater is a stunt. Not it's not "professional". It's done purely to get attention. Politicians and the press have unfortunately been conditioned to these kind of antics.
Months of careful and professional influence by a number of volunteers dressed in well tailored business suits have been ineffective with our Senate, people that appear to have forgotten who brought them to the dance.
How many of those impotently complaining here wrote a paper letter to their senator about the bill? How about even a phone call? Let's see the community dedication...
I know that it was too hot for many people to show up out there and stand in the sun with a gun rights sign, but a number of people drove to Raleigh and did just that. Many people on our side (unlike the strident anti-gun zealots) actually have jobs and work during the week. Many people attending took the day off work to attend.
Again - thanks for the constructive contributions here. Let's see what comes next...
For a better look, watch this misleading coverage from Greensboro:
http://www.wxii12.com/article/gun-rally-to-end-permits-for-conceal-weapons/11388278
Never forget that the press writes what they want, and that they are biased against lawful gun ownership.
Even the title of this coverage is inaccurate. Nothing is being done to change CCH or "end permits"...
http://www.wxii12.com/article/gun-rally-to-end-permits-for-conceal-weapons/11388278
Never forget that the press writes what they want, and that they are biased against lawful gun ownership.
Even the title of this coverage is inaccurate. Nothing is being done to change CCH or "end permits"...
Oh wonderful.
Lets see - in the other thread(s) it was mention that many have plans during the work week. I think the announcement for this was 6 or 8 days ahead of time...not enough for many to get off of work for a 11am meet in Raleigh.
Secondly, you meantion that it was not professional and done for attention only - we can all agree. But isnt that in contrast to what GRNC asked of the people in attendance? Look at the link I provided above, you'll find the exact quote.
So they tell everyone to come out and look profession, to 'dress for the press.' What happens - they send in two clowns in Rhino suits and THAT becomes the spectacle. Its not about the message, its about making the news and it will quickly be out of the minds of folks.
And what is so wrong with asking for attendance numbers?
I have taken issue with GRNC for a while...and its irritating to me. They get stuff done, and I have appreciated the legislation they have helped push. Paul Valone, however, came across to me as pompous and arrogant when I met him and saw him in a debate.
You posted this as I was typing, thank you for the link
I thought that HB746 was about making it to where adults (18+) didnt need a CCP to carry concealed, if not for that, then what is it about?
Look at the link just posted, looks like a dozen. Max. Including two in full rhino costumes and one in a mask.
Again, give people one week notice for a middle of the week event during the day and you cant expect too much.
Nothing wrong with asking for attendance numbers. I was there, but too busy to count heads. I think that the consensus was that attendance was disappointing.
I posted the link to WXII's item so that you can see attendance.
Every organization has a mix of people, and each individual has a personality to be dealt with. People that lead organizations often have strong personalities. I get it.
The thing to focus on is not personalities or event numbers, but getting things done. The path to political success takes a number of actions. Unfortunately, passive participation in forums isn't constructive when action is needed.
I get it... We're all comfortable now. Some of us don't like the idea of "Constitutional Carry", after all, we worked hard for our CCH permits. Why shouldn't everyone else?
The training is so important! It covers nothing tactical, and most instructors can't cover much of the law in 2 hours. I take two days when teaching the course, and don't accept more than six students in a class so that I can actually coach and help them develop some skills and understanding.
Yet I believe that we don't need a bureaucracy to control access to the right to defend yourself.
Don't let the cynical fake news press divide our community. Focus on what's important. Let's get this bill passed and signed into law.
I posted the link to WXII's item so that you can see attendance.
Every organization has a mix of people, and each individual has a personality to be dealt with. People that lead organizations often have strong personalities. I get it.
The thing to focus on is not personalities or event numbers, but getting things done. The path to political success takes a number of actions. Unfortunately, passive participation in forums isn't constructive when action is needed.
I get it... We're all comfortable now. Some of us don't like the idea of "Constitutional Carry", after all, we worked hard for our CCH permits. Why shouldn't everyone else?
The training is so important! It covers nothing tactical, and most instructors can't cover much of the law in 2 hours. I take two days when teaching the course, and don't accept more than six students in a class so that I can actually coach and help them develop some skills and understanding.
Yet I believe that we don't need a bureaucracy to control access to the right to defend yourself.
Don't let the cynical fake news press divide our community. Focus on what's important. Let's get this bill passed and signed into law.
OP
How many of those impotently complaining here wrote a paper letter to their senator about the bill? How about even a phone call? Let's see the community dedication...
Many of us wrote emails and called as GRNC asked on their email blasts.
The RHINO costume didn't give you a good view huh?
Many of us wrote emails and called as GRNC asked on their email blasts.
The RHINO costume didn't give you a good view huh?
As the guy who gifted the banner to Berger's office, I'm happy to know that so many of you are involved in effective pro-civil rights activism. I know I saw all of you out there, right? Or are you all content to sit home and complain on the interwebs? Is clictivism all you're good for?
When you show up, on short notice, on a day that the legislature is actually in session, then I'll cheerfully listen to your suggestions on how to make more progress. As the guy who lead the street protests against the MAIG/Everytown/MDA bus for Paul Valone, and the person who was in charge of running the entire counter protest against Gabby Giffords, I'd submit that I have far more experience in this sort of activity than you. Have you noticed the gun grabbers running their stupid protests in our state since? Why do you think that is? It's because we humiliated them so badly in the press that they don't want to risk coming back.
So you have two choices, and frankly I don't care what choice you make.
1. Bitch and complain about how we do our work
or
2. Sack the f#[k up and come out to help.
If you want to actually make a difference instead of complaining about how others secure your rights, feel free to PM me. Send me your email and let me know that you want to help out.
There's no glory in it. I got my name in the WRAL article and a photo of the back of my head. I spend money, I don't make money doing this. It's shit work at odd times with no notice, random people on the interwebs will bitch because they don't like how you do it, and it's only your civil rights on the line if we decide we just don't want to do it any more. But if you want to actually make a difference instead of complaining at your keyboard while stuffing another burger and fries down your gullet, PM me with your contact info. We have a LOT of work that needs doing and not nearly enough hands, heads, and hearts.
The rest of you feel free to express yourselves however you like. Just don't expect me to listen.
When you show up, on short notice, on a day that the legislature is actually in session, then I'll cheerfully listen to your suggestions on how to make more progress. As the guy who lead the street protests against the MAIG/Everytown/MDA bus for Paul Valone, and the person who was in charge of running the entire counter protest against Gabby Giffords, I'd submit that I have far more experience in this sort of activity than you. Have you noticed the gun grabbers running their stupid protests in our state since? Why do you think that is? It's because we humiliated them so badly in the press that they don't want to risk coming back.
So you have two choices, and frankly I don't care what choice you make.
1. Bitch and complain about how we do our work
or
2. Sack the f#[k up and come out to help.
If you want to actually make a difference instead of complaining about how others secure your rights, feel free to PM me. Send me your email and let me know that you want to help out.
There's no glory in it. I got my name in the WRAL article and a photo of the back of my head. I spend money, I don't make money doing this. It's shit work at odd times with no notice, random people on the interwebs will bitch because they don't like how you do it, and it's only your civil rights on the line if we decide we just don't want to do it any more. But if you want to actually make a difference instead of complaining at your keyboard while stuffing another burger and fries down your gullet, PM me with your contact info. We have a LOT of work that needs doing and not nearly enough hands, heads, and hearts.
The rest of you feel free to express yourselves however you like. Just don't expect me to listen.
GRNC President Paul Valone sends the following:
Which sounds to me like "Sack the f#[k up and come out to help."
If the following pisses you off, I can say only that after kicking tail for 23 years – for no money – I figure that I shouldn’t have to suffer fools.
For those unfamiliar with political tactics, here is today’s lesson:
I have to say that I am surprised that GRNC would continue to push for passage of HB 746, only to be met with derision from within the gun rights community. Maybe this is the product of the usual armchair quarterbacks who never get off their collective butts to actually defend what they whine about. But if the sentiment is widespread, just let us know and we will sit back and let the bill die.
I realize you may not have bothered to take the legislative tactics seminars we hold each year but, if you had, you would know that once politicians are ensconced in power, what they want most is to retain power. The best way to do that is to not piss anybody off. The best way to do *that* is to not actually do anything. Throw in an opportunity to draw their own districts and you have the inertia which now causes the General Assembly to forget about the gun owners who elected them.
Unless you have a few hundred thousand dollars you would care to contribute to our super PAC, that leaves us with the option of trying to sway them with scarce resources, especially since gun owners are not currently threatened as they were during the Obama administration, have largely gone back to sleep, and can’t be bothered to show up.
So what is the best way to sway politicians? To lampoon them. Better yet, to let the *media* lampoon them…free of charge. And how can we get the media (who hate us) to carry the message? Make it outrageous, of course.
And by the way, you will perhaps notice that the street theater we conducted was carefully nuanced to deliver to Phil Berger the message that we aren’t going away and that we are prepared to escalate to actually damaging re-election prospects for selected Republicans, while not pissing off the most powerful Republican in the state. In fact, what the ignorant are whining about is quite probably the most cleverly nuanced political operation we have ever orchestrated.
So if you think you can do better, come on up and give it a shot. Then maybe I can actually get time to shoot for a change.
Otherwise, go back to your Budweiser and your football game and let the volunteers with skill, dedication and motivation continue doing what they’ve done for 23 years: Kicking ass.
Paul Valone
P.S. If you don’t like what GRNC is doing, I suppose you can sign the “petition” and send money to NAGR operative Noel Fritsch and Reilly O’Neal’s rip-off calling itself “North Carolina Gun Owners.” I’m sure they will enjoy your money. Or I guess you could also throw money at the so-called “North Carolina Firearms Coalition,” run by another former NAGR operative, Patrick Parsons out of Georgia, which just sent me a lovely piece of fundraising mail imploring me to “Stop Roy Cooper’s Gun Control Bill!”, and saying that “Urgent Action is Needed” to defeat Rep. Pricey Harrison & Co.'s HB 723. Of course, HB 723 is already deader than a door nail (and was DOA when introduced), but I’m sure he too will be happy to take your money.
“Guerrilla theatre
Guerrilla (Spanish for ‘little war’), as applied to theatrical events, describes the act of spontaneous, surprise performances in unlikely public spaces to an unsuspecting audience. Typically these performances intend to draw attention to a political/social issue through SATIRE, PROTEST, AND CARNIVALESQUE TECHNIQUES. Many of these performances were a direct result of the radical social movements of the late 1960s through mid-1970s. Guerrilla Theater, also referred to as guerrilla performance, has been sometimes related to the agitprop theater of the 1930s,but it is differentiated from agitprop by the inclusion of Dada performance tactics.”I realize you may not have bothered to take the legislative tactics seminars we hold each year but, if you had, you would know that once politicians are ensconced in power, what they want most is to retain power. The best way to do that is to not piss anybody off. The best way to do *that* is to not actually do anything. Throw in an opportunity to draw their own districts and you have the inertia which now causes the General Assembly to forget about the gun owners who elected them.
Unless you have a few hundred thousand dollars you would care to contribute to our super PAC, that leaves us with the option of trying to sway them with scarce resources, especially since gun owners are not currently threatened as they were during the Obama administration, have largely gone back to sleep, and can’t be bothered to show up.
So what is the best way to sway politicians? To lampoon them. Better yet, to let the *media* lampoon them…free of charge. And how can we get the media (who hate us) to carry the message? Make it outrageous, of course.
And by the way, you will perhaps notice that the street theater we conducted was carefully nuanced to deliver to Phil Berger the message that we aren’t going away and that we are prepared to escalate to actually damaging re-election prospects for selected Republicans, while not pissing off the most powerful Republican in the state. In fact, what the ignorant are whining about is quite probably the most cleverly nuanced political operation we have ever orchestrated.
So if you think you can do better, come on up and give it a shot. Then maybe I can actually get time to shoot for a change.
Otherwise, go back to your Budweiser and your football game and let the volunteers with skill, dedication and motivation continue doing what they’ve done for 23 years: Kicking ass.
Paul Valone
P.S. If you don’t like what GRNC is doing, I suppose you can sign the “petition” and send money to NAGR operative Noel Fritsch and Reilly O’Neal’s rip-off calling itself “North Carolina Gun Owners.” I’m sure they will enjoy your money. Or I guess you could also throw money at the so-called “North Carolina Firearms Coalition,” run by another former NAGR operative, Patrick Parsons out of Georgia, which just sent me a lovely piece of fundraising mail imploring me to “Stop Roy Cooper’s Gun Control Bill!”, and saying that “Urgent Action is Needed” to defeat Rep. Pricey Harrison & Co.'s HB 723. Of course, HB 723 is already deader than a door nail (and was DOA when introduced), but I’m sure he too will be happy to take your money.
Which sounds to me like "Sack the f#[k up and come out to help."
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We all know you weren't going to help anyway. So no big loss.
Thanks... Way to rally someone to your team.
You know,... Nevermind, you won't hear it.
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OP
Many of us want to do things and want to help but with kids, jobs, and personal obligations, we can not just drop what we are doing on 3 or 4 days notice to go and rally or protest. Thence are several of us that want to help and are considering joining the GRNC as life members but quite frankly the pompous attitude because we were not able to stand at the legislature with you does not encourage me to want to join.
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@Marc , @Sean D Sorrentino
Thanks for all you both do.
As you have spent a great deal of time in your efforts, we have done likewise here supporting the gun community in setting up this forum and our community after our last on-line "homes" were sold off to left leaning media organizations. A lot of time has been invested. And we have opinions. And we share them. It's the internet. It's what happens on the internet
I see one of you has 13 posts here, and the other has 2, so just as you complain about the membership here not being engaged with activism, I see that neither of you are engaged here in our community, but we would welcome you to become more engaged. And it is a community. I have met hundreds of firearms enthusiasts through this medium and many have become my close personal friends. Some of them my best friends. I'm very involved with the shooting sports and participate almost every weekend. Yes, I get to shoot, but I also devote time and energies to help with the events when and where I can.
And I'm a Lifetime Member of GRNC. This forum supports GRNC as well.
I think I can understand the frustration having tried to marshall volunteer "armies" myself in the past. It can cause one to get burned out. That said, I would encourage you take the high road in your discussions with this crowd here. I can see how this will go if this tone is maintained. And it will not advance "our" cause. I hope this is received in the spirit that it is intended.
Thanks for all you both do.
As you have spent a great deal of time in your efforts, we have done likewise here supporting the gun community in setting up this forum and our community after our last on-line "homes" were sold off to left leaning media organizations. A lot of time has been invested. And we have opinions. And we share them. It's the internet. It's what happens on the internet
I see one of you has 13 posts here, and the other has 2, so just as you complain about the membership here not being engaged with activism, I see that neither of you are engaged here in our community, but we would welcome you to become more engaged. And it is a community. I have met hundreds of firearms enthusiasts through this medium and many have become my close personal friends. Some of them my best friends. I'm very involved with the shooting sports and participate almost every weekend. Yes, I get to shoot, but I also devote time and energies to help with the events when and where I can.
And I'm a Lifetime Member of GRNC. This forum supports GRNC as well.
I think I can understand the frustration having tried to marshall volunteer "armies" myself in the past. It can cause one to get burned out. That said, I would encourage you take the high road in your discussions with this crowd here. I can see how this will go if this tone is maintained. And it will not advance "our" cause. I hope this is received in the spirit that it is intended.
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OP
Is GRNC for constitutional carry?
Is that the same GRNC that previously wanted a special CHP with substantial extra fees, extensive extra training, psychological testing, etc. (the requirements were nearly as bad as the Federal Flight Deck Officer program), so that a very select few could have unlimited carry privileges?
I think I will just continue to support my representative's ongoing efforts to enact constitutional carry.
Is that the same GRNC that previously wanted a special CHP with substantial extra fees, extensive extra training, psychological testing, etc. (the requirements were nearly as bad as the Federal Flight Deck Officer program), so that a very select few could have unlimited carry privileges?
I think I will just continue to support my representative's ongoing efforts to enact constitutional carry.
np307
Happy to be here.
Maybe Paul Valone and the others crowing about how they know the best strategies and we just need to shut up and trust them can explain how this has actually worked according to plan. Anybody seen media stories that present this as anything more substantial than a laughable publicity stunt? It hasn't done jack squat. So don't tell me that this is all part of a well-constructed plan. It's a joke.
GRNC has done a lot of good for this state, but it has also done some questionable things. I support GRNC, I've enlisted others to support GRNC, I've made calls and sent emails, much like many others here. Yet anytime one of us has any contention with the leadership of the organization, we are insulted and told that we don't really know what we're doing and that GRNC knows best.
Mr. Valone can talk about having the right to not suffer fools, but if he thinks that this is an uninvolved membership that just sits around and complains, he's the only fool that's being suffered by anyone.
GRNC has done a lot of good for this state, but it has also done some questionable things. I support GRNC, I've enlisted others to support GRNC, I've made calls and sent emails, much like many others here. Yet anytime one of us has any contention with the leadership of the organization, we are insulted and told that we don't really know what we're doing and that GRNC knows best.
Mr. Valone can talk about having the right to not suffer fools, but if he thinks that this is an uninvolved membership that just sits around and complains, he's the only fool that's being suffered by anyone.
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I'm still waiting for them to respond to my direct question, in their own subforum here, from March.
wow.
Let me start by saying that Ive given to GRNC before, I dont think that I ever will again.
Once again I'll say what I said before:
-you gave no notice for a meet during the day on a weekday
-it was told to dress professionally etc and then this is the tactic that the GRNC takes, the opposite of what it tells others to do.
Also, while Im at it, stop that 'brung em to the dance' line, some backwoods slang that makes us (gunowners) seem like hicks.
I've been A GRNC member for several years. Over that time, I've donated hundreds of dollars including to the PVF. If this is the attitude and thanks we get, I'll go spend it elsewhere since I'm sure my contributions won't be missed either.
For the record, had been given more than a few damned days notice of the event, I would have used a vacation day and attended, which is also worth several hundred dollars. And you know what, Inwon't even get a direct benefit if this stupid bill passes.
So cut the attitude!
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We contribute by paying in money for group representation to GRNC. Many of the people posting in this thread are GRNC members. This forum pays as a sponsor with money contributed by these CFF members, so they have a valid excuse to express their opinion on this.
Unfortunately most conservative and libertarian leaning individuals work for a living, and can't travel to protests like those on the left. A protest isn't a good excuse for the boss. Plus we don't get paid like Bloomberg protesters. I'd love to be there, but I can't, so that's why we support gun rights organizations. Many of us write and call.
That said, I greatly appreciate what GRNC has done and will continue to do. This one time, I think this was a little cheesy, and an antic I expected from the left. It was sort of hypocritical to ask everyone to dress professionally and then have guys in fur suits. It will not effect what I think about GRNC, too much good there. Everyone makes a bad call every now and then, so nothing to worry over. GRNC will continue to stand for gun rights, and be the best option in NC.
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MadMan4Ever
Sig-Sauer devotee
I'm the chief coordinator for the Winston Salem gunshow, and you may see me there next weekend if this accursed summer head cold I have gives up... 
I am not paid for my efforts, I have to work until 5pm just like you folks. I wasn't able to attend due to health, but I was there in spirit.
Folks, try not to take things so personally. Paul may seem abrasive to you, but he has been doing this for years.... without pay. It takes time to do things, form intel, etc.
Hence his absence from the forum personally.
I just had lightning hit my house last week, so I'm only now back to having internet, plus as I said, I work for a living.
I have faith in Paul and GRNC. I deeply appreciate being able to legally carry into steakhouses since I don't drink alcohol. I appreciate being able to buy handguns with my CCP instead of having to use multiple pistol purchase permits...
GRNC knows what to do, its often just a matter of getting folks to take the time to email their representatives. It costs you nothing but time.
I wanted campus carry as the central focus but HB 746 won out, so I still gave it my full support. I emailed and called so many reps, I'm surprised I haven't been call blocked.
We need GRNC. We need to keep going. Trumps victory doesn't mean stop, it means now is the time to get rights back that shouldn't have been gone to begin with.
I am not paid for my efforts, I have to work until 5pm just like you folks. I wasn't able to attend due to health, but I was there in spirit.
Folks, try not to take things so personally. Paul may seem abrasive to you, but he has been doing this for years.... without pay. It takes time to do things, form intel, etc.
Hence his absence from the forum personally.
I just had lightning hit my house last week, so I'm only now back to having internet, plus as I said, I work for a living.
I have faith in Paul and GRNC. I deeply appreciate being able to legally carry into steakhouses since I don't drink alcohol. I appreciate being able to buy handguns with my CCP instead of having to use multiple pistol purchase permits...
GRNC knows what to do, its often just a matter of getting folks to take the time to email their representatives. It costs you nothing but time.
I wanted campus carry as the central focus but HB 746 won out, so I still gave it my full support. I emailed and called so many reps, I'm surprised I haven't been call blocked.
We need GRNC. We need to keep going. Trumps victory doesn't mean stop, it means now is the time to get rights back that shouldn't have been gone to begin with.