Hello all

Who's willing to stand up for the 2nd amendment for all?


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There’s a whole lot of “I support the Second Amendment, but...” going on in this thread, whether those particular words have been said or not, and truth be told, those saying it probably don’t even realize it.

For better or worse, I cannot find the “unless convicted of a felony” exception to the restrictions on government power imposed by the Bill of Rights.

If you claim to be a Constitutionalist, there’s no constitutional mechanism by which a person is denied their Rights unless they pay a fee to have them restored.

I was coming back to type something along these lines. Excellent point!!
 
SPM
There’s a whole lot of “I support the Second Amendment, but...” going on in this thread, whether those particular words have been said or not, and truth be told, those saying it probably don’t even realize it.

For better or worse, I cannot find the “unless convicted of a felony” exception to the restrictions on government power imposed by the Bill of Rights.

If you claim to be a Constitutionalist, there’s no constitutional mechanism by which a person is denied their Rights unless they pay a fee to have them restored.
SC380
I was coming back to type something along these lines. Excellent point!!

In total agreement with both of you. I think those guys call everybody else FUDDs.
 
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I'm not afraid to say that I support the constitution but felons should not automatically be given all their rights back. I'm perfectly fine with it given time and a proven record of staying out of trouble. So I'm a fudd.
 
I'm not afraid to say that I support the constitution but felons should not automatically be given all their rights back. I'm perfectly fine with it given time and a proven record of staying out of trouble. So I'm a fudd.

I agree with you too. Most felons should be promptly executed. But since our system stinks and we take it far too easy on them for whatever reason, there is no sense having an underclass of citizens who can't get gainful employment or defend themselves.

A short probation period to re-assimilate into society isn't unreasonable in my opinion.
 
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I agree with you too. Most felons should be promptly executed. But since our system stinks and we take it far too easy on them for whatever reason, there is no sense having an underclass of citizens who can't get gainful employment or defend themselves.

A short probation period to re-assimilate into society isn't unreasonable in my opinion.

I agree for non violent felonies and so has the government in the recent years. But there are things that should still be no go's imo. Here is a pretty good blog post about the subject even though it's a little older.

https://nccriminallaw.sog.unc.edu/gun-toting-felons/

This one is pretty relevant as well.
https://www.sog.unc.edu/blogs/nc-cr...-approves-justification-defense-firearm-felon
 
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One thing that I have not seen mentioned very much in this thread and in most such discussions is the victim. The victims seem not to be important and their life after being violated by a criminal does not get as much attention or sympathy as the plight of the criminal.
 
You do understand that the vast majority of felonies are nonviolent crimes, and those crimes that are defined as felonies so voluminous you probably commit more than one every day?

I dare say I did not commit a felony today. I did commit a Larceny of the Hersey kisses kind to the tune of about 8 kisses.
 
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I'm not afraid to say that I support the constitution but felons should not automatically be given all their rights back. I'm perfectly fine with it given time and a proven record of staying out of trouble. So I'm a fudd.
One thing that I have not seen mentioned very much in this thread and in most such discussions is the victim. The victims seem not to be important and their life after being violated by a criminal does not get as much attention or sympathy as the plight of the criminal.
Maybe the law should let the victims decide the criminals punishment. Just saying. I could've live with that. No matter how harsh.
 
I dare say I did not commit a felony today. I did commit a Larceny of the Hersey kisses kind to the tune of about 8 kisses.

You ever get junk mail with a neighbor's name on it?

Did you ensure it reached it's named or addressed recipient?

Or do you toss it in the trash with the unsolicited junk mail addressed to you?

18 USC 1702

"Whoever takes any letter, postal card, or package out of any post office or any authorized depository for mail matter, or from any letter or mail carrier, or which has been in any post office or authorized depository, or in the custody of any letter or mail carrier, before it has been delivered to the person to whom it was directed, with design to obstruct the correspondence, or to pry into the business or secrets of another, or opens, secretes, embezzles, or destroys the same, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years, or both."

Any sentence over a year is a felony per the Federal government. Is it likely that the Postmaster General is going to come after you?

No. But it is a felony.

Sooo.......you a felon or a saint?
 
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You ever get junk mail with a neighbor's name on it?

Did you ensure it reached it's named or addressed recipient?

Or do you toss it in the trash with the unsolicited junk mail addressed to you?

18 USC 1702

"Whoever takes any letter, postal card, or package out of any post office or any authorized depository for mail matter, or from any letter or mail carrier, or which has been in any post office or authorized depository, or in the custody of any letter or mail carrier, before it has been delivered to the person to whom it was directed, with design to obstruct the correspondence, or to pry into the business or secrets of another, or opens, secretes, embezzles, or destroys the same, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years, or both."

Any sentence over a year is a felony per the Federal government. Is it likely that the Postmaster General is going to come after you?

No. But it is a felony.

Sooo.......you a felon or a saint?

Yawn. No not today or can you not read. I said I'm pretty sure I didn't commit a felony TODAY. You really need to remove the stick from your butt.
 
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Yawn. No not today or can you not read. I said I'm pretty sure I didn't commit a felony TODAY. You really need to remove the stick from your butt.

I know what you said. But OP didn't commit his felony TODAY either, and he's actually completed his sentence.

And I would love to get rid of the stick - but it's proving far too useful for knocking on the walls of all the glass houses in this particular neighborhood...
 
I know what you said. But OP didn't commit his felony TODAY either, and he's actually completed his sentence.

And I would love to get rid of the stick - but it's proving far too useful for knocking on the walls of all the glass houses in this particular neighborhood...

Lol yeah I'd like to see this charge actually convicted on a stand alone charge and put some one in prison.
 
Lol yeah I'd like to see this charge actually convicted on a stand alone charge and put some one in prison.

See I'm the exact opposite, and posted it to highlight the absurdity of the"most felons deserve a swift execution" argument.

it-will-be-of-little-avail-to-the-people-if-20198252.png

I bet most on this board didn't even know it's a felony.
 
Damn, some of you guys would argue with a fence post. Have you met my wife?

I am reminded of a story: A traveler passing through a small town in the South observed that there were two Baptist churches side by side. He asked a man on the street why such a small town required two Baptist churches. The man said, "Well, one of them teaches that Pharaoh's daughter saw the baby Moses in the bulrushes, and the other one teaches that Pharaoh's daughter said she saw the baby Moses in the bulrushes."
 
Damn, some of you guys would argue with a fence post. Have you met my wife?

I am reminded of a story: A traveler passing through a small town in the South observed that there were two Baptist churches side by side. He asked a man on the street why such a small town required two Baptist churches. The man said, "Well, one of them teaches that Pharaoh's daughter saw the baby Moses in the bulrushes, and the other one teaches that Pharaoh's daughter said she saw the baby Moses in the bulrushes."

Then there's the one down the block that teaches "How did she know it was Moses? She read the nametag on the inside back of his swaddle. That's how !"

:D
 
See. It is all about what happens to the criminal and not about the victim.

Of course; in a free society, the greater injustice is that an innocent person is punished than it is that 10 guilty go free.

That's why 5 of the first 10 Amendments to the Constitution, ratified in 1791 and popularly called the Bill of Rights - a full 50% - restricts the power of the government to violate the Rights of those accused of a crime.

It was done deliberately, on purpose - and is that important of a concept (and a result of the abuses that naturally occurring when the government has far too much power).
 
Have y'all seen the big butts down in the...... oh wait...... nevermind.:D
 
The more I think about it... The more I see... The punishment fits the crime. In my case anyway. I got on drugs, stole to get said drugs. My freedom was taken, but for a time. Yet something, near and dear to me was taken and most likely never to be returned. Seems pretty fair to me. I guess I should change my poll.
 
The more I think about it... The more I see... The punishment fits the crime. In my case anyway. I got on drugs, stole to get said drugs. My freedom was taken, but for a time. Yet something, near and dear to me was taken and most likely never to be returned. Seems pretty fair to me. I guess I should change my poll.
Does anyone here know how to change the poll? I don't want to shut it down, just edit the wording a bit.
 
This thread is useless unless u are felon. Me I love all my bang sticks and I have a lot of them buddy welcome but go get your stuff straighten out because most of us do not know where to go to get your rights restored because we are not in your situation. Glwys but your poll is useless will I fight for my 2nd amendment right yes but yours no because you forfeited them when u committed your crimes . I personally am glad the government takes that away from felons about the only thing I agree with they do but man up and accept it or do what u have to do to change it. Wooooooooooooo
 
You do understand that the vast majority of felonies are nonviolent crimes, and those crimes that are defined as felonies so voluminous you probably commit more than one every day?

I don't know the exact breakdown of laws written vs felons convicted to say what constitutes a vast majority of either. But a significant portion of people convicted of felonies are convicted of violent felonies, organized crime, or property/other crimes severe enough that I am fine with sending them to the gallows. You'd have to show me several thousand convictions for throwing away mail before I take that one seriously.

Obviously in this utopia we are discussing, there would be none of these nonsense felonies that worry you.
 
That's why 5 of the first 10 Amendments to the Constitution, ratified in 1791 and popularly called the Bill of Rights - a full 50% - restricts the power of the government to violate the Rights of those accused of a crime.
You've hit on a good point. No innocent should be denied their rights but once the person, has been subject to due process, and found guilty they should loose some rights until such time as they have proven their resolve to not abuse those rights again.
 
Of course; in a free society, the greater injustice is that an innocent person is punished than it is that 10 guilty go free.

That's why 5 of the first 10 Amendments to the Constitution, ratified in 1791 and popularly called the Bill of Rights - a full 50% - restricts the power of the government to violate the Rights of those accused of a crime.

It was done deliberately, on purpose - and is that important of a concept (and a result of the abuses that naturally occurring when the government has far too much power).

I certainly understand that. I think the greatest injustice is for an innocent person to be punished for something he did not do. That is not the point. There were two parties to the crime, the criminal and the victim. Great care should be taken to insure the rights of the accused and the victim during the investigation and trial. After a guilty verdict is returned, however, the victim seems to exist no longer. A great effort is made to try to rehabilitate the convict so he can again become a productive member of society while the victim seems to be left to recover from the harm done to him on his own. What effort is made to try to make the victim whole again? Is restitution to the victim by the convict a common thing? Are the costs of medical and mental healing covered by the criminal? I imagine they are in some cases, but is it a common occurrence? What happened to the people from whom the OP stole? Did he return their property? What effort was made by the court and the OP to try to make the victims as much as possible the way they were before the crime? Perhaps I just do not hear of these efforts. I have been a victim of crimes and have never received any sort of restitution even after the criminals were caught and convicted. It was just my tough luck that it happened and that I just need to suck it up, forget about it, and carry on as if it never happened.
 
. Yet something, near and dear to me was taken and most likely never to be returned.

What about something near and dear to the people from whom you stole? Will their peace of mind or physical possessions ever be returned to them? It does not seem fair at all if they are not.
 
I certainly understand that. I think the greatest injustice is for an innocent person to be punished for something he did not do. That is not the point. There were two parties to the crime, the criminal and the victim. Great care should be taken to insure the rights of the accused and the victim during the investigation and trial. After a guilty verdict is returned, however, the victim seems to exist no longer. A great effort is made to try to rehabilitate the convict so he can again become a productive member of society while the victim seems to be left to recover from the harm done to him on his own. What effort is made to try to make the victim whole again? Is restitution to the victim by the convict a common thing? Are the costs of medical and mental healing covered by the criminal? I imagine they are in some cases, but is it a common occurrence? What happened to the people from whom the OP stole? Did he return their property? What effort was made by the court and the OP to try to make the victims as much as possible the way they were before the crime? Perhaps I just do not hear of these efforts. I have been a victim of crimes and have never received any sort of restitution even after the criminals were caught and convicted. It was just my tough luck that it happened and that I just need to suck it up, forget about it, and carry on as if it never happened.
What you are talking about is the reason we have probation and parole. A condition of probation is that the offender pay restitution to the victims as well as fees and expenses for the trial. The same for Post release (Parole). Often the offender (note the term offender as they are no longer suspect or defendant) will not pay the expense involved in the probation cases and when that happens they are taken back to court for violating the conditions of their probation. The problem here is that judges are reluctant to send someone to prison for nonpayment of fees and they are never recovered.

Post release is when they are in prison and let out early with the condition that they commit no crimes and pay restitution. The post release will rarely do a violation for non payment alone. When someone its sentenced to prison and does the whole term there is no monetary punishment involved.

So, yes victims are a part of the equation but sometimes don't receive the justice they deserve.
 
Looks l
I certainly understand that. I think the greatest injustice is for an innocent person to be punished for something he did not do. That is not the point. There were two parties to the crime, the criminal and the victim. Great care should be taken to insure the rights of the accused and the victim during the investigation and trial. After a guilty verdict is returned, however, the victim seems to exist no longer. A great effort is made to try to rehabilitate the convict so he can again become a productive member of society while the victim seems to be left to recover from the harm done to him on his own. What effort is made to try to make the victim whole again? Is restitution to the victim by the convict a common thing? Are the costs of medical and mental healing covered by the criminal? I imagine they are in some cases, but is it a common occurrence? What happened to the people from whom the OP stole? Did he return their property? What effort was made by the court and the OP to try to make the victims as much as possible the way they were before the crime? Perhaps I just do not hear of these efforts. I have been a victim of crimes and have never received any sort of restitution even after the criminals were caught and convicted. It was just my tough luck that it happened and that I just need to suck it up, forget about it, and carry on as if it never happened.
I'll tell you this, as a matter of fact. I spent 37 months in prison. Pretty much half was considered brown clothes(medium security) the rest minimum(green clothes) When I made it to green clothes, due to good behavior I was granted work release. It was one of the most hardest jobs I've ever had in my life. I worked for 18 months untill my release. Out of my payroll I was granted 40$ a week, the rest went into a trust. Month after month I'd watch the money grow and disappear. I'm told the money went to the victims and rightly so. 33000 was paid in restitution. Upon my release I was on parole, part of the stipulations of my parole was paying restitution. After fulfilling my obligations and having my rights restored. I still owed 600 dollars to the tune of which the state will surely get the rest of this tax season. So to answer your question... Yes, some victims do get compensated for their property. Is it an exact science, does it make them feel better? Probably not.
 
Good. I am glad to hear that the victims were not forgotten.
Sir I'd like to thank you for not letting me forget about the victims. I learned a lot about myself in just three days of posting this thread. I came in here all fired up about seeing the erosion of our constitution. It was never ment to come across as a thread all about me. I've seen since I've been out, our liberties and freedoms attacked on so many fronts, I was a bit riled up. Seeing triple amputees being persecuted for supporting the Wall, hearing Douglas Ducote Sr. On YouTube talk about the threats on his life( both real American patriots if you ask me), and countless others being slandered, threatened, and hated for standing up for what's right. I cant right a wrong. I am fully aware of Right and wrong. I just wanna live Right. On a lighter note. No Russian collusion was found!
 
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