Hoping for the best, preparing for the worst...CMPD

Bailey Boat

Bailey Boat

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Film of Burger King shooting to be released at 2:00 today. Must not be good....

Prepare to fasten seat belts??
 
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Cowboy said:
Could be nothing
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I agree, and that would be enough to set them into "protesting" again like last time... When even the democrap city council needs to have a special news meeting there is more than likely "something" to it...

Do we know if the officer is black or white?? That could/would make a difference...??
 
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The professional protesters will be out whether it was a justified use of force or not.

I guess they don't want to protest for the real issues like the nightly killings of thier brethren.
 
Bailey Boat said:
I agree, and that would be enough to set them into "protesting" again like last time... When even the democrap city council needs to have a special news meeting there is more than likely "something" to it...

Do we know if the officer is black or white?? That could/would make a difference...??
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The officer who shot Keith Scott was Brentley Vinson who was black. So it really didn't matter.
 
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*I never liked His Highness the Burger King anyway.
 
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Bailey Boat said:
I agree, and that would be enough to set them into "protesting" again like last time... When even the democrap city council needs to have a special news meeting there is more than likely "something" to it...

Do we know if the officer is black or white?? That could/would make a difference...??
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I believe it was a white female who is near retirement.
 
Looks a little fuzzy to me, I slowed it way down and he came up with the gun but not by the grip. Looked like he had it by the top of the slide and never pointed it at either officer. In real time she may have been justified, she can't slow it down for a better look...
 
I think you're gonna see in that video whatever you want to see in that video. This is just enough information to confirm whatever bias you bring into it. And the news has been slow. Things might get interesting...
 
Catfish said:
I think you're gonna see in that video whatever you want to see in that video. This is just enough information to confirm whatever bias you bring into it. And the news has been slow. Things might get interesting...
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Probably so. When multiple officers are telling him to put the gun on the ground, I expected to see him holding a gun.
 
I was walking after lunch and just heard a 7-8rd volley of rifle rifle toward W. Sugar Creek and Harris.
Only 2 way ranges up that away
Gonna take on a few on the 38 murders so far in Char Cago NC
 
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I still don't understand how someone can just ignore 2 police officers pointing guns at them and telling them to drop the gun? The guy just looked at the cops and then continued talking to the person in the car like the cops weren't even there. Then he moves his hands twice and gets shot on the second move. How long is an officer supposed to wait for a guy that is ignoring them and then makes a movement with his hands before they shoot? If the lady had waited until she saw the barrel turning towards her, it may have been too late for her? What if his movement was getting ready to shoot the person in the car? The info police had was on a guy waving a gun around and threatening folks.
 
Hmmm ... just a 2 1/2 minute video (1 minute of which is the LEO in route) is tough to make a call from more info from the FOS who I’m guessing she was suppose to be backing up. It does show for at least 45 seconds they told the guy to put the gun down. He makes a movement while still squatting down on the off side to the LEOs but what he exactly did is not really clear to me and that’s when the female LEO fired.

Personally I believe this shoot will be one that will cause a big uproar and no matter what facts pertaining to events before or even the LEO’s frame of mind during will make any difference to public opinion. Charlotte better be ready for some protesters to stir it ... the Mayor and other local liberal politicians will very likely make a deal to settle with the family ASAFP but it won’t stop protests until the LEO is put on trial.

I am glad I am not in Mecklenburg Co and would have to sit on the jury for this one ... but again from that short video clip it’s not fair to pass judgement one way or the other ...
 
I’m okay with it.

Did seem like maybe he wasn’t processing, but it doesn’t matter IMO, once you start brandishing you’ve put yourself in a position where being misunderstood can have serious consequences.
 
No matter what the final findings are, I predict that the family gets a settlement like NCFubar said and that the officer takes early retirement.
 
Beto was in town this morning, wonder if they scheduled the release to coincide with his departure, also wonder if he mentioned gun or police violence during his speech.
 
Chuckman said:
Truth is irrelevant and facts can be ignored as one pursues whatever agenda is sexy.
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Saw a trailer for a new movie coming out "The Kid". One line in it says it perfectly......It doesn't matter what happened here...all that matters is the stories they will tell.
 
I agree with a lot said that the office doesn't have a pause and zoom feature but even at regular speed, there was no visible gun. You had some dumb azz woman standing next to a guy saying he has a gun. But you never see a gun. You have to actually SEE the gun before your can fire on someone. There were no threatening movements made by the guy. He may look like he acted weird but he may just be paralysed with fear trying to figure out what to do. People don't know you can DROP a gun. In the movies they always go off when you drop em. Maybe they should change their language to PUT down the gun and never DROP the gun. That way everyone's expectations are set.

All that said, if you carry a gun, legal or not, you accept the risk associated with living and dying by the sword.
 
Too bad there wasn't an armed customer or employee in the store to take him out when he started waving the gun around to start it all?
 
Justified or not, the officers’ poor commands contributed to this outcome.

Don’t get me wrong, the deceased holds a LARGE part of the blame for putting himself in this situation to begin with, and it’s impossible to know his intent when grabbing for the gun, but if he truly decided to finally comply after 20+ commands, a command to touch the weapon, which was their major concern to begin with, is a verrrry poor way to secure the situation.

Much better commands would have been:

“Put yours hands on your head and get on your knees”
“Lay down on the ground, hands above your head”
“Hands on your head, turn away from me”
Etc etc

Anything that DOESNT instruct him to touch the gun.

The Scott incident was MUCH cleaner and the city still went to shit. This will be a disaster.
 
SPST said:
Too bad there wasn't an armed customer or employee in the store to take him out when he started waving the gun around to start it all?
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Maybe we should get rid of having cops. Make The People become responsible for their own protection like the nation's founders intended, which they really are, but they'd be forced to realize it. Having armed "law enforcement" is a fairly new concept anyway, and one that is constitutionally dubious except for the length of time the courts have accepted it (and it's guaranteed that they would).
 
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I watched it under a frame by frame scrub and I see both points of view.

Cop POV:
The cop is yelling at a guy over and over to drop a gun. He reaches for and draws out said gun. He is then shot

Suspect POV:
Cop is yelling to drop gun. Reaches in to drop gun, is shot. There is no way for the officer to know what’s in his mind, surrender or fight. He should’ve put his hands up and said he was surrendering and he didn’t feel safe touching the gun.

What the officer could NOT see in the real time motion is that he reached to wherever he had the pistol tucked, and pulled it out with a limp grip with the barrel down and away. I think he was going to drop it BUT watching it at real time, it looks like he pulls it and points it towards the car occupant. Only under fine scrutiny is in more clear. There’s no way that draw looked harmless until the frame is frozen

Hand empty and partially concealed
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Reached in and is retrieving gun which is close to his body
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Weapon drawn but limp wrist and gun pointed away/upside down
Vznmyax.jpg



This is a tough one
 
Not an expert on shootings by any means but I’ll echo that this looks to my untrained eye as a justifiable but not “good” shoot. Still, homey went out in public waving around a pistol and there ended up being consequences for his actions

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
 
The main thing I see is apparently no one in the US speaks English anymore.
What is so hard to understand about " Sir Put the weapon down " over and over again...
I think I would be communicating that I was going to put it on the ground.

I don't know if this falls into the guidelines of proper use of a weapon by the officer or not. Do you wait for the guy to turn the gun and shoot you since he's not responding in anyway to commands?
 
Whichever way you see it this does reinforce something I've heard many times: Don't carry something you would feel bad about bouncing off pavement. Cause when you're told to drop it, you better drop it.
 
Catfish said:
Whichever way you see it this does reinforce something I've heard many times: Don't carry something you would feel bad about bouncing off pavement. Cause when you're told to drop it, you better drop it.
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But if you are told to drop it and it's in your holster, are you going to pull it out and drop it? Not me! I'm putting my hands up and not moving a muscle.
 
Raleigh PD had similar shooting, guy had ankle holster, pant leg up, would not comply,
had a handgun but family claimed it was his bible.o_O
 
I've read several references to him waving the gun around before the cops arrived. Do we know this to be fact or what was reported. I ask because we've all read stories about some anti gunner calling cops to report a person "waving a gun around" when it turns out to be a CC who's gun may have been exposed when bending over. I'm not making assumptions because I don't know and I wasn't there. Don't know if it's a good shoot or not but I do wonder how you're supposed to drop your gun without touching it. I agree with @Jerzsubbie that they should have commanded him to spread eagle with arms out and disarmed him from there. If they had we may not be having this discussion.
 
She only had a split second (LITERALLY) to determine that A) he did have a gun, B) he had it in his hand C) He was moving the gun....

I most likely would have reacted in the same manner with the same, predictable outcome. He had more than ample opportunity to change the situation and refused to do so, bad on him....
 
JakeH said:
Not an expert on shootings by any means but I’ll echo that this looks to my untrained eye as a justifiable but not “good” shoot. Still, homey went out in public waving around a pistol and there ended up being consequences for his actions

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
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Agreed and I think that part in bold (emphasis added by me) is what will be the crux of the divide in those trying to rationally debate the situation. Justified != good
 
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