J. C. Higgins 101.7

I have a small stack of internals for 311/savage/springfield/fox. Free. Let me know. Levers. Triggers and springs. Hammers I think. Prolly coil springs for hammers. .may have Sears, may also have firing pins and springs. If ya need it I'll look/drop it in a flat rate to ya. No use for it here.


Wow that is awesome. I really appreciate that. I had replaced one of the firing pin springs because it was hanging out around the back of the firing pin. I found a spring close to it and cut some coils off of it and hoped it would work. Haven't had a chance to try it yet but working on the stock and trying to get the fit right I can see that this firing pin doesn't retract like the other one does so I am not sure it will work. I will PM you my address. Will be happy to send the funds for shipping . Thanks again.
 
Well fitting of the action is 95% done. I will probably dress it up a little before I finish. Shaping of the stock has begun.


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Started out once again with the block plane upside down in the vice but the stock is too big for that. Pulled out an old antique draw knife I bought a while back and sharpened it up( cut the tip of my index finger doing that). This thing is pretty good at removing material.

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Once I get it really sharp it will even do it smoothly.
 
wow!

There was a lot of work accomplished between those last two photos.

I really respect your skill in being able to do this. That's really impressive work!
 
I can appreciate your patience, but I can only marvel at your skills from afar. And I am especially glad to hear that you are feeling better.
 
wow!

There was a lot of work accomplished between those last two photos.

I really respect your skill in being able to do this. That's really impressive work!



Thank you for the kind words. There is still a lot to do on the stock alone. I am currently seeking a spokeshave. I can order one online but prefer an older one that can be brought back to life and put to good use. The area around the pistol grip is slow work because of the curves and changes in grain direction. The spoke shave will help with this. Here is a shot of the seam where the two halves were joined
I dont think it will show to badly once finish is applied.


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Boy, that join line really disappeared.

I'm with you re: vintage tools. Most all of my mechanics hand tools were bought used, American made, and older, when quality mattered.
 
OMgahhhhhh are we not done yet?!? ;) LOL. Looking great.


Far from it. There is still a ton left to be done. After the stock is shaped I have to decide on a finish for it. BLO or true oil or some sort of poly finish. Who knows. Then there is the matter of bluing the barrels. I am currently leaning toward a rust blue , so that is something I have to learn to do. Then what to do with the receiver and the forearm iron. They were color case hardened originally but that is outside the scope of my pay grade. May have to just rust blue them too. Time will tell.
 
Far from it. There is still a ton left to be done. After the stock is shaped I have to decide on a finish for it. BLO or true oil or some sort of poly finish. Who knows. Then there is the matter of bluing the barrels. I am currently leaning toward a rust blue , so that is something I have to learn to do. Then what to do with the receiver and the forearm iron. They were color case hardened originally but that is outside the scope of my pay grade. May have to just rust blue them too. Time will tell.
I hope you know I am kidding. I just get excited when I can "see" what its gonna be in a few months.

So, I just sent a rifle to Long Hunter Shooting Supply in Texas. They do bone case hardening. Its much cheaper than Turnbull. If you are gonna really sink the cash in this, since it looks as you are putting a lot of heart and soul in it, you may think about contacting them for the case coloring. I get my rifle back today. Ill post a pic. They have a pic on their website too. www.longhunt.com
 
I hope you know I am kidding. I just get excited when I can "see" what its gonna be in a few months.

So, I just sent a rifle to Long Hunter Shooting Supply in Texas. They do bone case hardening. Its much cheaper than Turnbull. If you are gonna really sink the cash in this, since it looks as you are putting a lot of heart and soul in it, you may think about contacting them for the case coloring. I get my rifle back today. Ill post a pic. They have a pic on their website too. www.longhunt.com



Absolutely. No offense taken. I wish I could afford to send it off for case hardening but it would cost more for that than it will be worth when done. Unfortunately I am on a strict budget here. Been out of work since the end of 2018 and finally had to retire so funds are limited.

This is a labor of love since I always wanted to make a stock. I have made pistol grips and a couple of forearms but never a stock. It is definitely a lot of work but I am loving it. Plus it keeps me busy since getting around is not so easy anymore.
 
Absolutely.
depending on how hot it got, it could have softened every bit of steel.
If it was put out with water, it could harden the barrel and cause it to rupture.

If the springs still work and do not loose power that is a good indication that at did not get hot enough to change temper, but you only get 10 fingers.
These old shotguns often have very abrupt forcing cones, and smaller ID barrels for the fiber wads of the day.
Modern shells with plastic wads are already upping the pressures.

Not sure on that model but its always good to check if it was rated for smokeless powder.
It doesn't look old enough to be a 2 1/2" chamber or need black powder equivalent loads but that would be something else to check.

I would run some hot proof loads through it from a safe distance before I trusted my face next to it.
I agree with the gun plumber
 
I am assuming you know, but just in case you didn't:
The inletting at the rear tang radius will need to be clearanced a few thousandths or it will have the potential to crack the stock.
Inletting it with one or more ply of tape (depending on tape thickness) on the top and bottom radius is usually a good way to ensure it has clearance and will look correct.
Couldn't tell from the picture if it had clearance or not, but I have seen a bunch of stocks crack that way.
 
I am assuming you know, but just in case you didn't:
The inletting at the rear tang radius will need to be clearanced a few thousandths or it will have the potential to crack the stock.
Inletting it with one or more ply of tape (depending on tape thickness) on the top and bottom radius is usually a good way to ensure it has clearance and will look correct.
Couldn't tell from the picture if it had clearance or not, but I have seen a bunch of stocks crack that way.


Really! Please explain. I was thinking just the opposite. The back of the receiver is tapered hence the inletted area is wider at the front than at the back of the inlet. I was thinking the radius on the receiver would need to have good contact with the stock(like a recoil lug) to prevent it from moving backwards during recoil and acting like a wedge causing the stock to split. Edumacate an old man please. ;)
 
I'd have thought the same as you...that the additional support from the broad radius of the tang against the shelf of wood, would distribute the load better than a screw would (which concentrates all the load in one point).

I'm not sure how it could not.
 
You want the recoil to be absorbed into the stock at the vertical shoulders at the front - not at the tang



I am always happy to learn something new or have a misconception I hold corrected. What is the down side of having the recoil distributed through all three point? The two vertical shoulders and the radius of the tang. Not being a smart ass here. I am asking a serious question. It seems to me if there is a gap at the radius it would only allow the tang to move backward over time allowing the wedge shape of the tang to split the vertical shoulders.
 
I think you would have to start out with that tiny gap at the tang to end up with all three points of contact after shooting. I’m no smith, but I owned a rifle that had no clearance at the tang when new - and after shooting, it blew a small chunk out of the stock at the tang. I’ve seen it more than once. Unless the whole action is in perfect contact everywhere (as in glass bedded), things are gonna settle in a wee bit after shooting. I’m just passing on my observations, maybe someone more knowledgeable will elucidate - but if it was mine, I’d start with just a little clearance there.
 
@Joshua Needham
@Red Marley

I appreciate your advice guys. I have too much work in this thing to screw up now so I have been pouring over videos of stock inletting mainly because once I take it off I can't put it back. I need to be sure before I add clearance. I realized I have not previously shown a photo of the receiver. Joshua mentioned the top and bottom tang. This receiver is one solid piece from top to bottom and not 2 individual pieces. That gives a lot more surface area at the radius for recoil tranfer. It also has a stock screw that comes in from the butt of the stock which will be pulling the receiver into the stock. Base on that would you still say there is a need for the clearance?

Honest questions here guys. I am in a learning phase here.


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The issue is the wrist is the weakest part of most any stock, and it is going to be the fail point on a break action.
Just not allot of wood to speak of containing the recoil, the grain often doesn't flow with the wrist when selected as a blank, and the geometry causes force to be imparted both rearward and outward.
Because the rear tang is not flat, but a half circle it will act like a splitting wedge to some extent if the recoil is largely on that surface.
You see this not only on shotguns but anything with a narrow rear tang like a mauser.

If the rear tang becomes the main recoil absorbing surface it spreads the stock as it bites deeper and the sides start to cam the sides of the wrist outward.
Think of it like hitting a piece of firewood with a sledge hammer vs an equally sized wedge.
It is the sides of the wedge pushing outward that split the wood fibers, not the blade cutting the wood.
A flat compresses the wood in the stock rather than spreads them.
A round does both, and largely spreads.
This is only made worse by most factory stocks either having little internal end grain sealing internally or none at all.
That causes any moisture and or oil to wick in to this weak spot and further weaken the wood over time.

Relying on the rear tang some may be okay, but if it is mostly putting force on the rear that is when they go.
Light contact would be acceptable as long as most the recoil is going into flats.
It is admittedly a problem of design more than anything.
If they would make rear tangs flat it would fix most the problem, but wouldn't look as good to the eye.

If it was mine, I would use one ply of tape as an approximate .0025 tolerance spacer to then either inlet the rear slightly oversized, or better yet bed the front surface to it.
Either way when you remove the tape the rear will be out of contact.
After firing enough rounds the fibers of the wood will likely compress such that it does contact in the rear, but it will not be the main recoil absorbing surface anymore.

You will undoubtedly find people who disagree with me, and some of them may well be more educated on the subject.
I am going off being taught stock making by someone who knows more than I, making 2 from blanks, fitting a bunch of replacements, and repairing way more.
A broken wrist on a double gun is not uncommon for the aforementioned problems.
If you keep an eye out for wood compression, and snug your rear screw that will help allot.
They loosen as the inletting is compressed, and once loose becomes more of a hit than a push.

Your millage may vary, but the nature of a stock is to fail by splitting/shearing along the grain when spread not compressing.
So the more you can avoid recoil trying to split the stock and only compress the fibers the better.

Hope that is helpful.
 
It does. Thanks for the explanation. The wedge affect was what I was concerned with when I was cutting the inlet. I drilled a hole just short of where the end of the inlet was to go and removed most of the material with a drill bit slightly smaller than needed. Finished up with an old oil lamp for a smudge pot and fitted it as close as I could. Watching the sides spread apart caused me to understand what would happen if it moves backward much at all. I will go back and adjust with the tape as you mentioned.

Again thanks for the advice and the explanation. Always open to learning something new.
 
I always glass bed those stocks all the way around. The vertical and the horizontal surfaces.
 
A flat compresses the wood in the stock rather than spreads them.
A round does both, and largely spreads.
This is only made worse by most factory stocks either having little internal end grain sealing internally or none at all.
That causes any moisture and or oil to wick in to this weak spot and further weaken the wood over time.
Do you think applying an epoxy (hardening) sealer to the endgrain & exposed wood on the inside of the inlet would help? It might both seal and beef up the wood in that area.

Getting it in there w/o accidentally getting some on the exposed wood of the stock might be tricky... if you're a slob-handed bubba like me.
 
End grain will pull in allot of varnish.
I usually use Brownells custom oil, but any wood sealer should do fine.
It hardens once cured.
Everyone seems to recommend something different in the books I have on stock making, or even make blends, but that's my go-to for most things.
If you really want maximal absorption you want to basically mop on your first coat, let it sit and wipe off the excess when it stops wicking in.
You can use thinner, or warm temperatures to get it to thin a bit and thus soak in a little more that first coat.
 
I always glass bed those stocks all the way around. The vertical and the horizontal surfaces.


I am not really familiar with glass bedding. I have never tried it. The videos I can find are all about rifles but they show removal of wood to be replaced by the bedding material.

On this stock I don't see a lot of area where material could be removed and replaced with out showing on the outside. Maybe an area at the radius but not a lot at the vertical flats. Where would you recomend removing material. Would the small area at the vertical flats be enuff to make a difference?

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If your wood is already good and tight fitting I would just clean it really well with alcohol and use the original Acraglass without any dye in it.
You can take a rotary tool and worm out some areas with a small round burr if you like, but it shouldn't need it.
That is more required with older oil soaked wood, or slicker material stocks.

You really don't really need to bed it if you have good wood to metal contact.
It will however maximize the surface area of the wood to metal fit.
The thing you want to be sure of is mixing it as directed and using a minimal amount because if you have a bunch of push-out get in the finer workeybits of the gun you are going to have some work on your hands.
Plumbers putty does a good job keeping it out of places you don't want it if you pack it in before you use your release agent is applied.

Any time you are working with bedding compound spend less time thinking "where do I want compound" and more time thinking "where do I not want compound".
You can well imagine how people don't think about making a mechanical bind where compound flows around things like the back of your receiver then sets up.
Then you are in deep trouble.
 
If your wood is already good and tight fitting I would just clean it really well with alcohol and use the original Acraglass without any dye in it.
You can take a rotary tool and worm out some areas with a small round burr if you like, but it shouldn't need it.
That is more required with older oil soaked wood, or slicker material stocks.

You really don't really need to bed it if you have good wood to metal contact.
It will however maximize the surface area of the wood to metal fit.
The thing you want to be sure of is mixing it as directed and using a minimal amount because if you have a bunch of push-out get in the finer workeybits of the gun you are going to have some work on your hands.
Plumbers putty does a good job keeping it out of places you don't want it if you pack it in before you use your release agent is applied.

Any time you are working with bedding compound spend less time thinking "where do I want compound" and more time thinking "where do I not want compound".
You can well imagine how people don't think about making a mechanical bind where compound flows around things like the back of your receiver then sets up.
Then you are in deep trouble.


Well the rotary tool makes good sense. I was thinking how bad it would be to try it with a chisel. Does it have to be something specific for glass bedding or will regular fiberglass resin work? If so what could you use as a release agent? Trying to keep this a low budget as possible. I already have the fiberglass resin.
 
I am not really familiar with glass bedding. I have never tried it. The videos I can find are all about rifles but they show removal of wood to be replaced by the bedding material.

On this stock I don't see a lot of area where material could be removed and replaced with out showing on the outside. Maybe an area at the radius but not a lot at the vertical flats. Where would you recomend removing material. Would the small area at the vertical flats be enuff to make a difference?

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It's not a remove replace for these stocks. Skim coat on a well fitted inlet to toughen and seal the grain of the wrist. 120g scuff in the inlet will provide lots of "bite" for the glass to grab I prefer acragel since it wont run out before kicking over. Similarly I bed the forend iron and barrel reliefs.

Block the oils, stops rot, keeps fit tight.
 
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It's not a remove replace for these stocks. Skim coat on a well fitted inlet to toughen and seal the grain of the wrist. 120g scuff in the inlet will provide lots of "bite" for the glass to grab I prefer acragel since it wont run out before kicking over. Similarly I bed the forend iron and barrel reliefs.

Block the oils, stops rot, keeps fit tight.


Wow! I never thought about the barrel reliefs or the forearm iron. I am really getting an education on this one.

One question. If this is for sealing the end grain to keep oil out should I do the other end too or is that just a waste of time and material? I realize there is less chance of oil at the butt plate end but there is a lot of end grain area there.
 
Although tang fitment varies as wood shrinks, swells, gets compressed. For Marlin tang fitment, so as not to chip out, factory specs have been maintained at 0.03. They have just reduced the specification to 0.02 which they feel is sufficient to prevent chip out and cracking and be more aesthetically pleasing to the consumers. Of course I have seen some older ones you could pitch a cat through. Somewhat different from your situation since it is a single basically flat tang compared with what you have which will already spread the recoil over a wider area.
 
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Wow! I never thought about the barrel reliefs or the forearm iron. I am really getting an education on this one.

One question. If this is for sealing the end grain to keep oil out should I do the other end too or is that just a waste of time and material? I realize there is less chance of oil at the butt plate end but there is a lot of end grain area there.

Seal the end grains where it butts to metal. Wrist, forearm iron. You can seal with several coats of thin wiping urethane as well but it won't impart any strength. Free float the barrel channels if you prefer A strip of thin tape on the underside provides all the gap you could want and then its likely only the tip of the forend would contact the barrells. I usually don't bother to free float the forend.
 
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