I have a 460S&W, however recently acquired some 45 colt brass for near free. I was looking at load data for the 45 colt, and it looks like I can basically make 45 colt "magnum" loads with H110. Anyone do this? I'm not worried about hurting the gun, as obviously these are nothing for the gun. I just don't want to overdo what the brass was meant for. It looks like I can basically shoot 44magnum level loads out of my 460. Not quite 454, but not "plink" level 45 colt.
Loading 45 colt "magnum"
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RR
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You can use H110. I prefer Lil Gun as it's a bit more consistent.
20.1 gr of Lil Gun under a 260 gr hard cast does 1275 fps out of my 5.5" blackhawk with less recoil than a comparable 44 Mag load. Out of the Rossi 92 that same load gains almost 500fps.
20.1 gr of Lil Gun under a 260 gr hard cast does 1275 fps out of my 5.5" blackhawk with less recoil than a comparable 44 Mag load. Out of the Rossi 92 that same load gains almost 500fps.
Chihuahua Floyd
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If you ever get a 45 Colt in anything short of a SBH, make sure not to put one of them in it. Otherwise go ahead.
Got a story about that. Went to the range once and a State Trooper I knew was down there shooting his old model Vaquero in .45 Colt. He couldn't figure out why he wasn't getting an accurate pattern from the gun. Found out he'd loaded 300 gr. bullets at 1200 FPS and they were all over the place.
He let me run a cylinder through it and my first round was right where I aimed it, the second round was right beside it and the third round was several inches away and the last three were all over the place. After the first couple of rounds there was just no cure for flinching with that combination.
He let me run a cylinder through it and my first round was right where I aimed it, the second round was right beside it and the third round was several inches away and the last three were all over the place. After the first couple of rounds there was just no cure for flinching with that combination.
Mike has a 45 Colt load that I am shooting in the 3 1/2 inch Freedom Arms. It is a 300 grain bullet at 1,600 fps out of a 16 inch barrel.
Do Not Put This In A 45 Caliber Ruger Blackhawk....
@Michael458 tell them about this please.
Do Not Put This In A 45 Caliber Ruger Blackhawk....
@Michael458 tell them about this please.
MacEntyre
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My 45 Colt pistol is a Redhawk. Seems to do jus' fine with heavy loads.
A friend loaded it up and shot six 38-40s... Ruger fixed it for free.
A friend loaded it up and shot six 38-40s... Ruger fixed it for free.
georgel
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Just make sure the brass is modern production brass and not the old balloon head brass, since it sounds like brass of unknown origin. But, yeah, even some "medium" loads with say 9.5gr of Unique under a 255gr Keith, ones that are hotter than cowboy, but not max should be fun.
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There are so many different guns out there in 45 Colt, one really has to be extremely careful. I have been shooting and loading 45 Colt for many years in many different types of guns, from the Colt SA and Small Taurus 5 shot guns, to the big Redhawks. I also have several lever guns in 45 Colt, and use a M94 16 inch gun for pressures. I keep 45 Colt for heavy loads to 45000 PSI. This is way too much for Colt SA/Taurus 5 shot guns, which should not exceed around 18000 PSI, too much for S&W N Frames which should not exceed around 23000-25000 PSI, and I believe the Blackhawks are rated at or close to 30000 PSI. The big Super Redhawks you can shoot just about anything in those, but when I was shooting I would keep those to 45000 anyway, because you just don't need anymore than that..........Honestly in handguns a 100 fps more is not going to do anything for you. I have shot animals with 45 Colt with heavy loads at 1600-1700 fps in the lever guns and it is not very impressive to tell you the truth. Not when you compare it to a rifle cartridge of similar caliber at 2000+, with a proper bullet of course. One of my favorite bullets and velocity for 45 Colt was a 250 Gold Dot at 1300 fps, the bullet performed extremely well at those velocities and gave better terminal performance than many 300s at 1500-1700 fps.......
The loads I did for @BatteryOaksBilly are heavy doses of WW 296 and come in at 45000 PSI. He wanted heavy, and I think that is about as much as you do in 45 Colt cases. Loads at 45000 PSI in 45 Colt starts to work the brass hard.
I a not familiar with the 460, but I would imagine you could shoot any 45 Colt you wanted in it. But for the longevity of the brass I would hold it to 45000 or less....... And of course the same in a 454.......
I had a 454 Redhawk, I shot mostly heavy loads of 45 Colt in it.
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Unless you have a 45 Colt chambered gun, then I don’t think I would mess with the 45 C brass. It isn’t like you can’t recover your 460 brass, and it is easy to download the 460 for softer shooting, just use a faster burning powder. Seated in the longer brass, there will be less jump to the lands, and less carbon buildup in the cylinder to clean afterwards. Sell the 45C brass to someone that needs it.
An excellent point. Carbon buildup from shorter brass is a pain to scrub out. Over time, it can get to be so much that it is hard to chamber the longer cartridge. The only gun I have done this with was the 454 and it could be a problem at times. This ended up being a test gun in the end to test loads and bullets in both 45 Colt and 454.
My 3 1/2 inch round butt Freedom Arms measures Less than .002.
RR
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I looked into the forcing cone issue several years ago.
Oddly enough the discussion around gas cutting and forcing cone erosion was started by folks shooting high end Freedom Arms guns. Seems the issue arises when pushing light for caliber bullets at higher velocities with lil gun.
I've shot several pounds through a Blackhawk with no visible changes to the top strap or forcing cone. I'm not running light bullets and I'm not running at max either.
I'll keep using it. YMMV....
RR
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Oh no argument there. Wouldn't even think of doing it.
Just that the flame cutting issue as I understand it. Comes from a combination of the close tolerances of the FA along with people hot rodding light boolits.
At least that's what I found several years ago when I dig deeper into the "don't use lil gun in a revolver" issue
Got a five shot blackhawk Leonard Baity did back in the late 90's for me. I run a 300 wfn at 1545fps from a 7.5" barrel. 49,500psi measured by White Laboratories. You're probably around 45-46,000. The blackhawk proofs at 64,000. It might not blow, but it sure would get loose in a hurry.
Jmoser
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I have a Ruger Bisley Vaquero - .44 mag converted to .45 Colt by Bowden. I load 300 gr XTP and LBT, also 335 gr LBT to outer space levels.
Since acquiring a .454 I save the 335s for that and stick with 300s, have some 250s at moderate levels for fun.
Of course cylinder gap is a concern for flame cutting but mine is a custom fit.
H110 and CCI magnum primers; Lee Factory Crimp die for a heavy duty crimp.
Sold my companion 1894 but those carbines are a real hoot with these loads.
Since acquiring a .454 I save the 335s for that and stick with 300s, have some 250s at moderate levels for fun.
Of course cylinder gap is a concern for flame cutting but mine is a custom fit.
H110 and CCI magnum primers; Lee Factory Crimp die for a heavy duty crimp.
Sold my companion 1894 but those carbines are a real hoot with these loads.
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contender
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As a longtime reloader,, as I read these posts,, I kept thinking; "lawyers & liability."
Loading a 45 Colt to levels above normal levels for modern handguns,, (45 Magnum) is asking for trouble. Maybe not right away,,, nor even for you. I have loaded many 45 Colt loads,, shot them in Rugers, FA's & such. All within normal loads for these guns. If I had a 460, I'd load 460 brass to the levels I enjoy,, (meaning the most accurate,, not necessarily heavy, fire breathing, loudenkickenboomers) and leave the brass in 45 Colt loaded to levels acceptable for that caliber.
This post made me cringe; "Went to the range once and a State Trooper I knew was down there shooting his old model Vaquero in .45 Colt. He couldn't figure out why he wasn't getting an accurate pattern from the gun. Found out he'd loaded 300 gr. bullets at 1200 FPS and they were all over the place."
Next,, this post screams lawyers & liability.
"The loads I did for @BatteryOaksBilly are heavy doses of WW 296 and come in at 45000 PSI. He wanted heavy, and I think that is about as much as you do in 45 Colt cases. Loads at 45000 PSI in 45 Colt starts to work the brass hard."
Loading for other people,, if you get compensation in ANY form,, is considered manufacturing ammo by the ATF. A license is required. And if the "friend" gets killed or injured,, who's liable? Who is the family gonna sue? I know folks say; "My buddy would never sue me." But,, ask yourself; "What about the wife or kids?"
And what will you do if you were to suddenly die,, and your family takes the ammo & lets a friend,, or even your own family members use "magnum" level loads in a 45 Colt & they get injured. You'll be dead,, but you will be the reason it happened. Your surviving family members will be the ones to suffer.
This was an excellent post; "Unless you have a 45 Colt chambered gun, then I don’t think I would mess with the 45 C brass. It isn’t like you can’t recover your 460 brass, and it is easy to download the 460 for softer shooting, just use a faster burning powder. Seated in the longer brass, there will be less jump to the lands, and less carbon buildup in the cylinder to clean afterwards. Sell the 45C brass to someone that needs it."
Good advice.
Reloading should be done to improve accuracy in a gun, or to get a bullet type for a specific purpose not offered by a factory. But to reload thinking you have to max out or exceed known maximum charges or to push the limits of any mechanical object is asking for potential trouble.
Reloading for other people,, or pushing beyond the tested limits,, is asking for trouble. I have a blown up Super Blackhawk, (that I bought that way,) that I use in my Hunter Safety classes to show students that guns CAN & WILL fail if improperly loaded. I also personally witnessed a S&W J-frame get destroyed by hot 38 spl loads. Luckily,, all that happened was the frame stretched, the cylinder got the brass welded to the walls, and the gun was toast. I wish I'd bought that one to use as a demo as well.
And if injury happens,, think "Lawyers & lawsuits" and not just by the gunman,, worry more about the family.
My wife was a paralegal,, and she said lawyers file lawsuits,, on anyone & everyone they can even think might have been involved. It's called; "Sue everybody & see what sticks."
So, for the OP,,, yes,, the 460 can & will easily use the 45 Colt brass. If loading,, I'd consider loading it to more normal .45 Colt levels. And as noted above,, you will be looking at cylinder scrubbing a bit if you do a lot of it. Or,, sell it & buy more 460 brass & download it some if softer ammo is desired.
I have loaded 454 brass to 45 Colt levels,, to allow easier cleaning,, and softer shooting loads. Same with 357's. Same with 327's & 32 H&R Mags.
As a Range Safety Officer,, I PREACH,,,,,,, "Safety First!" This goes for handloading ammo as well.
Loading a 45 Colt to levels above normal levels for modern handguns,, (45 Magnum) is asking for trouble. Maybe not right away,,, nor even for you. I have loaded many 45 Colt loads,, shot them in Rugers, FA's & such. All within normal loads for these guns. If I had a 460, I'd load 460 brass to the levels I enjoy,, (meaning the most accurate,, not necessarily heavy, fire breathing, loudenkickenboomers) and leave the brass in 45 Colt loaded to levels acceptable for that caliber.
This post made me cringe; "Went to the range once and a State Trooper I knew was down there shooting his old model Vaquero in .45 Colt. He couldn't figure out why he wasn't getting an accurate pattern from the gun. Found out he'd loaded 300 gr. bullets at 1200 FPS and they were all over the place."
Next,, this post screams lawyers & liability.
"The loads I did for @BatteryOaksBilly are heavy doses of WW 296 and come in at 45000 PSI. He wanted heavy, and I think that is about as much as you do in 45 Colt cases. Loads at 45000 PSI in 45 Colt starts to work the brass hard."
Loading for other people,, if you get compensation in ANY form,, is considered manufacturing ammo by the ATF. A license is required. And if the "friend" gets killed or injured,, who's liable? Who is the family gonna sue? I know folks say; "My buddy would never sue me." But,, ask yourself; "What about the wife or kids?"
And what will you do if you were to suddenly die,, and your family takes the ammo & lets a friend,, or even your own family members use "magnum" level loads in a 45 Colt & they get injured. You'll be dead,, but you will be the reason it happened. Your surviving family members will be the ones to suffer.
This was an excellent post; "Unless you have a 45 Colt chambered gun, then I don’t think I would mess with the 45 C brass. It isn’t like you can’t recover your 460 brass, and it is easy to download the 460 for softer shooting, just use a faster burning powder. Seated in the longer brass, there will be less jump to the lands, and less carbon buildup in the cylinder to clean afterwards. Sell the 45C brass to someone that needs it."
Good advice.
Reloading should be done to improve accuracy in a gun, or to get a bullet type for a specific purpose not offered by a factory. But to reload thinking you have to max out or exceed known maximum charges or to push the limits of any mechanical object is asking for potential trouble.
Reloading for other people,, or pushing beyond the tested limits,, is asking for trouble. I have a blown up Super Blackhawk, (that I bought that way,) that I use in my Hunter Safety classes to show students that guns CAN & WILL fail if improperly loaded. I also personally witnessed a S&W J-frame get destroyed by hot 38 spl loads. Luckily,, all that happened was the frame stretched, the cylinder got the brass welded to the walls, and the gun was toast. I wish I'd bought that one to use as a demo as well.
And if injury happens,, think "Lawyers & lawsuits" and not just by the gunman,, worry more about the family.
My wife was a paralegal,, and she said lawyers file lawsuits,, on anyone & everyone they can even think might have been involved. It's called; "Sue everybody & see what sticks."
So, for the OP,,, yes,, the 460 can & will easily use the 45 Colt brass. If loading,, I'd consider loading it to more normal .45 Colt levels. And as noted above,, you will be looking at cylinder scrubbing a bit if you do a lot of it. Or,, sell it & buy more 460 brass & download it some if softer ammo is desired.
I have loaded 454 brass to 45 Colt levels,, to allow easier cleaning,, and softer shooting loads. Same with 357's. Same with 327's & 32 H&R Mags.
As a Range Safety Officer,, I PREACH,,,,,,, "Safety First!" This goes for handloading ammo as well.
I have been reloading since the mid 1960's and have always been on the conservative side. The only problems I have ever had were when I did not load a round hot enough to work properly. I stick to the manuals and published data. I do not try to hot rod loads. If I want more power than what a particular chambering typically offers I will buy a bigger gun with the power I seek. I have never tried to push the limits because I really have no accurate way to tell when a load is too hot. Most people should, indeed, stick with published data and should not sell their reloads,
There are some people, however, who have the equipment, knowledge, and experience to venture into Indian Country with their loads safely. I would imagine that they are very concerned with safety. These are not the shadtree bubbas who save a buck or two by fixing their own cars at home but rather the NASCAR racers who push the limits of performance. I am glad the NASCAR people do what they do even though I would never try to duplicate their levels of performance. I am glad the experimental loaders do what they do even though I would never try to duplicate their levels of performance. I do not get the idea that either the NASCAR people or the experimental loaders think it would be wise for me to try to duplicate their levels of performance. I may have missed it but do not remember the people who are straining the limits giving complete data for their loads or offering their hot loads for sale.
There are some people, however, who have the equipment, knowledge, and experience to venture into Indian Country with their loads safely. I would imagine that they are very concerned with safety. These are not the shadtree bubbas who save a buck or two by fixing their own cars at home but rather the NASCAR racers who push the limits of performance. I am glad the NASCAR people do what they do even though I would never try to duplicate their levels of performance. I am glad the experimental loaders do what they do even though I would never try to duplicate their levels of performance. I do not get the idea that either the NASCAR people or the experimental loaders think it would be wise for me to try to duplicate their levels of performance. I may have missed it but do not remember the people who are straining the limits giving complete data for their loads or offering their hot loads for sale.