PSA- Exploding Savage 10 ML-II Muzzleloader

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Iowa City, Iowa
• It was the opening day of deer hunting season, and Ronald Hansen says he loaded his rifle the same way he had countless times before, aimed at a target and fired a shot.

This time, the gun barrel exploded, knocking the farmer from Hampton, Iowa, backward, severely damaging his right hand and ear and burning his face.

Unknown to Hansen, the manufacturer of the rifle that injured him in 2014 had received other complaints of explosions and injuries over the prior decade. Customers repeatedly reported that the barrel of the stainless steel 10 ML-II muzzleloader exploded, burst, split or cracked, according to thousands of court documents reviewed by The Associated Press.


Lawyers for the company, Westfield, Massachusetts-based Savage Arms, were expected to appear Wednesday in federal court in Iowa to defend against a lawsuit filed by Hansen. He is seeking damages for his injuries, alleging the company failed to warn customers about the defect.

It’s one of several lawsuits that have claimed the company recklessly kept the muzzleloaders on the market even as they kept occasionally mangling hands, damaging hearing and burning faces. At least three have been settled on a confidential basis since last year.

Martin Crimp, a Michigan State University metals expert who examined a 10ML-II that exploded and caused a hunter to lose multiple fingers in 2009, told the AP the barrel of that gun was “metallurgically defective.”

An expert hired by Hansen’s lawyers came to a similar conclusion, saying the steel used to make the rifle was prone to catastrophic failure after repeat firings.

Anthony Pisciotti, an outside lawyer for Savage Arms, said he wasn’t authorized to comment. A spokesman for its parent company, Vista Outdoor, didn’t return messages.


Savage Arms, which discontinued the gun in 2010 after thousands were on the market, has insisted it’s safe when used properly, has no defects and was designed in accordance with industry standards.


In this 2009 photo provided by Trent Procter, a Savage Arms stainless steel 10ML-II muzzleloader owned by Procter of Swan River, Manitoba, Canada, is displayed weeks after its barrel exploded and severely injured his left hand. Savage Arms recently agreed to pay a confidential settlement to Procter to resolve his lawsuit, one of several that allege the company kept a defective firearm on the market. (Gordon Harris/Trent Procter via AP)
Savage Arms has argued that operator error is to blame for the explosions, saying users must have created too much pressure inside the barrel either by loading two bullets or using the wrong amount or type of gunpowder. It has issued a safety notice on its website warning owners to “carefully follow the safe loading procedures” in the product manual to avoid injuries.

Hansen’s case highlights how gun makers, unlike manufacturers of other consumer products, have the sole discretion to decide themselves whether to recall potentially dangerous weapons. In 1976, Congress blocked the newly-created Consumer Product Safety Commission, which has broad authority to regulate everything from toasters to toys and BB guns, from restricting the manufacture or sale of firearms.

“It’s an example of an industry that can essentially do whatever they want and there’s no consequences other than being held accountable in a civil liability context,” said Kristen Rand, legislative director of the Violence Policy Center in Washington D.C.

Other companies have faced allegations that they allowed unsafe guns to stay on the market. Remington agreed to replace triggers in its popular Model 700 rifles — only after several lawsuits claiming that they were prone to accidentally discharging. Ruger was accused of marketing revolvers for decades that could fire when dropped.

Savage Arms recently agreed to settle a lawsuit filed by Trent Procter, who was on a hunting trip with friends in October 2009 when the 10 ML-II he’d owned for years “just blew apart” when he shot at a target.


Procter, 48, missed nine months of work from his job as a power company lineman as he endured surgeries on his left hand and rehabilitation. He had to move to a different job and still experiences numbness due to nerve damage in his hand, where he’s missing parts of his thumb and middle finger.

Photos of Procter’s hand were shared on hunting websites after the explosion, and he said it was insulting that some suggested he and not a defective product was to blame.

“I’m surprised it was never recalled or a warning was put out that this was actually happening,” he said. “It’s quite scary when you think about it.”

Last year, the company also settled a case brought by Michigan hunter Rodney Palatka and his wife, who was pregnant with twins and suffered a miscarriage after witnessing her husband’s injuries.

James Putman of North Carolina alleges in a pending lawsuit that his Savage 10ML-II burst as he hunted last year in the George Washington National Forest, blasting his thumb off and forcing his early retirement as a firefighter.

Savage Arms started making the 10ML-II in 2001. It was designed to withstand the use of smokeless powder, which appealed to some shooters because it didn’t require the same messy cleanup as black powder.


The company’s knowledge of the barrel problems is becoming clear after years of lawsuits.

In Palatka’s case, a federal magistrate in 2015 sanctioned the company for a “purposeful record of obfuscation” that included falsely claiming that it was aware of only two prior explosions while withholding information that showed otherwise.

The company acknowledged in Hansen’s case that it received 45 legal claims related to burst or split barrels dating to 2004. Hansen’s lawyers say documents show Savage Arms created a special “muzzleloader return team” and faced hundreds of warranty and service claims.

Some hunters were offered free replacement rifles after they were told their errors caused the damage.

Hansen, 50 and a lifelong hunter, testified in an August deposition that he followed the recommended procedures when he loaded his 10ML-II, which he bought in 2010 and had shot 200 times. He said he weighed and loaded 43 grains of the recommended powder and one bullet. He set a target at 50 yards, laid on a dirt pile, aimed and fired.

Hansen, who was rushed to the emergency room after the explosion, testified he still struggles to hear even with a hearing aid and cannot perform some farm chores due to his hand injury.


Savage Arms has suggested that Hansen used an improper mix of powders that caused too much pressure. Trial is set for next year.

Source: http://www.sltrib.com/news/nation-w...loding-rifle-leaves-trail-of-injured-hunters/
 
A guy I used to work with had this happen last year hunting in va. He is actually referenced in the article above. His was a stainless savage ml2. He lost his right thumb in the accident eventually leading to him retiring. Crazy that’s for sure. I’m very Leary of smokeless mzl now. I wanted one bad before my buddy got messed up.


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Wow is right. My first thought was overcharged or used pyrodex in a rifle only designed for black powder but after reading the article it's pretty clear the metallurgy isn't right and they knew it.
 
I have one but it is not SS. So far no problems?????????????????
 
Moral of the story, use only the powder specified and in amounts lower than the listed max. There is no need to load up to the max just because you can. Bambi won't be any deader with another 100fps. Think the pokey old black powder cartridge rifles are weak? Just tell me how many buffalo are still roaming the amber waves of grain. Point is, you don't need tons of power, all that extra fps and power does is allow you to be a crappy shot.
 
Moral of the story, use only the powder specified and in amounts lower than the listed max.

Absolutely. I can understand trying to make black powder rifles more accurate, but it probably is not a good idea to try to match the ballistics of a .300 Win Mag with it.
 
From the report, overloading or even max loading wasn't the issue, metallurgy was.
 
Whether you load to maximum or not completely depends on the rifle and what you’re doing.

I had a TC encore with a stainless barrel that I routinely loaded with 150 Grains of pyrodex and a 180 grain ballistic tipped sabot. Damn thing was a tack driver to 250 yards with that setup and I took several deer as far out as 300 yards with a little holdover.

Even dropped one big doe at a full gallop accoss a field at about 100 yards once. My best shot. Caught her mid leap and she was DRT.

I was hunting in MD at the time where you couldn’t use centerfire rifles and most shots were 175-250 yards.
 
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That's something I've never understood about the "regulations". You can't use a center fire rifle shooting bullets of 200 grains at 2500 fps, too dangerous!!! But it's okay to use a black powder rifle shooting bullets of 200 grains at 2500 fps, safer....

Are we ever going to have intelligent, educated people writing the regs??
 
Here's another thing to consider. In centerfire cart guns, some powders are sensitive to case capacity AND temperature. Now, let's think through the scenario where our intrepid hunter has worked up a load in pursuit of that last bit of fps and energy that is tip toeing on the edge of capacity of the gun. Being a "modern muzzleloader" rated for smokeless, there are no cartridge cases to act as the canary in the ballistic coal mine with respect to pressure signs (and let's be honest here, most nimrods think a muzzleloader can take as much powder as you can stuff in). Let's posit that his powder has issues with temp in regards to pressure curve and burn rate. Load was worked up at a balmy 30F firing from a shaded bench and he's hunting early season at 65+F and the gun has been basking in the sun and is at 80+F. Suddenly, that load that was somewhat safe at one temp may now be a pipe bomb. Guys who shoot in the precision rifle and benchrest games are well aware of this issue. Just one more reason I don't care for "modern" muzzleloaders.
 
From the report, overloading or even max loading wasn't the issue, metallurgy was.
Metallurgists used are nearly a joke.
The only way they could test the true, various, strength of the barrel, would be to test an unfired barrel. I doubt that ever happened. It is easy to get the composition of the steel but the processing is where strength and integrity come in.
I would say, that the true problem likely lies with the user. I personally have one and absolutely love it. 65 grains of RL 7 behind a 290gr Barnes. Likely about (500) loads fired and no issues. There are too many people out there that want to play around with loads, trying to max them out, doubling up on sabots, and hand knurling Bullets..... essentially working up to a pipe bomb........
They should stop being Vaginas and own their screw ups.. if your gonna be dumb you gotta be tough.
 
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Just a thought. If this was a center fire rifle having the same issue and every incident was linked to hand-loads, I am a reloader, would our assessment of the firearm be different or the same?
 
Would be interesting of they could obtain existing rifles with s/n before and after so they can destructive them in the lab.
 
My money's on operator error (or stupidity).

Realistically, all a modern firearm does, from the trigger perspective, is allow the shooter to get by with marginal skills in range estimation, trigger control, etc. Most of the shots in my hunting area are less than 200yd. At that distance, my pokey old 58cal musket will still poke a 60cal hole with a 500+gr boolit and that's it there is no expansion. Hit bone and the hole can easily get much larger. Lots of Rebs and Yanks went into the ground or lost limbs from that "marginal" round. Even more Indians and buffalo expired from the "weak" 45/70 and 50/70.

So, yeah, that's why I'd believe Sidney Stoopid was involved.
 
“It’s an example of an industry that can essentially do whatever they want and there’s no consequences other than being held accountable in a civil liability context,” said Kristen Rand, legislative director of the Violence Policy Center in Washington D.C.

I trust her less than the gun companies. The gun companies can be held liable in a civil court. What other consequences is she advocating for? Criminal? How liable is the government for deaths on their heads like those resulting from CAFE standards in cars that resulted in cars being made lighter and possibly not as structurally sound? Sure as hell I wouldn't trust the government to write safety regulations for firearms.

https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2010/04/death_by_cafe_standards.html
 
I stopped reading after this. They can't even get which hand was hurt correct.
Could be flipped picture, or the guy that owned the second barrel. "its barrel exploded and severely injured his left hand.","Photos of Procter’s hand were shared on hunting websites after the explosion"
 
I'm happy with my good ol CVA with 90gr and a 240gr XTP. Every deer hit with it has dropped dead within eyesight, and I know my range limitation. It's easier for me to get closer to what I'm shooting at than attempting to be Chris Kyle in the deer woods.
 
That picture of the rifle with the exploded barrel looks like a textbook pic of what a squib would do with a round fired behind it. My money is on the good old used it last season, pulled the cap, put the gun up with the load still in it, took it out and put a second load on top of the first. I've see it before. I'm in the operator error camp.
 
I was always leery of the smokeless muzzleloaders. Also wary of using 150 grains of powder in "magnum" rated muzzleloaders for similar reasons.
I never had the balls to shoot 150 grains of powder. 100 was as high as I went
 
I never had the balls to shoot 150 grains of powder. 100 was as high as I went

I did, quite a bit. Then I realized I wasn't really getting a lot of payoff for the extra thumping. Backed down to 2 50 grain pellets and been happy since.
 
Metal fatigue is a thing. I cannot count the number of times I have to mention that to people who reload. Just cause it works once or twice doesn't mean it is a safe option
 
Just a thought. If this was a center fire rifle having the same issue and every incident was linked to hand-loads, I am a reloader, would our assessment of the firearm be different or the same?
Not sure the angle of the question but I'll say, I have seen several issues with hand loads with VARIOUS manufactured rifles. Likely more than the savage ML II. In those cases, everyone says it's the loaders fault... in this case, many are inclined to point the finger at savage... and the speculation is "it's not happening with other rifles" Savage is the only manufacturer "to my knowledge", that has mass produced a smokeless muzzle loader. To top it off, it could be sold to any idiot with the money to buy it..... so all to say....you have people creating loads for a broad band of center fire rifles Vs. many people creating hand loads for one specific Muzzleloader.... I still back savage and I am not at all a savage fan due to a shitty customer service experience in 2009. However, I have had several experiences with metallurgists, steel fatigue, and steel failure. The claims that are made by the privately hired metallurgists can easily be swayed one way or another.. the fact is, the test is useless on the barrel that has already blown up. No one knows the true structural values of the steel pre-explosion because no one knows the pressure or stress it was previously exposed to.
 
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Just realized that this story is from December last year....any updates I couldn't find anything recent
 
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