Reduced .223 loads

[Sasquatch]

I just had shoulder surgery and I'll be out of any serious shooting for a while (even shooting offhand). I've built my son and wife some pretty cool .223s lately, but I've made them heavy (wooden stock AR for her, 24" barrel for him) so that they would not have as much felt recoil. I need something to pass the time and coming up with some interesting loads can occupy that.

I had good luck with a non-hot recipe of 22.8gr of H335 going against @Butter 's bullets. That's 2.4 grains down from my normal hot load with other 55 grain bullets. It is noticeably softer than my ammo.

But I was doing some reading and stumbled on that H4895 is considered a reduced load powder- Hodgdon says it can use starting loads of 60% of max for powders they list, and .223 is one of them.

Has anyone tried reduced loads with 4895? Doing more reading, and having actual recipes, reduced loads can be done for larger bore rifles with Accurate 5744. Oddly, this thread here alleges that 5744 was a culprit in a recent detonation but seems suspect.

 

[Ikarus1]

Yes. H4895 is the sugar tits in .223, just a tad expensive compared to ball powder but it does everything well in the .223 case.

60% of 25gr is 15grs of H4895, I haven't loaded any below 20 but 20gr behind a 55gr pill should cycle just about every semiauto and still give almost nil recoil while still giving 2400fps speed out of a 20 inch bolt gun. Good stuff!

remember kids, hydrostatic shock is a real thing according to the local whitetail population

 

[Toprudder]

I've done reduced loads with H-4895 in 223, 30-30, 7.62x39. The powder performs well.

For 223, I was looking for lower recoil loads for my AR pistol. Using 55gn bullets, I went as low as 21.5gn and it cycled my gun. I did not chrono the loads, though, so I don't have velocity data for that. I did chrono loads in my 16" carbine from 24.5gn (2784fps) to 26.0gn(2973fps) if that helps.

Keep in mind that IMR-4895 is a different powder and can't be downloaded like H-4895 can.

I've also used H-4198 for reduced loads in my AR pistol. I have loaded 20.0gn behind 43gn bullets and it cycled just fine.

For the reduced loads in a 16" AR, I suspect a carbine length gas system might be more reliable than a mid-length gas system.

 

[11B CIB]

IMR4198 is a loooong skinny stick powder so I imagine the 4895 would meter better. If that’s a consideration

I use a lot of H4895 but haven’t used 4198 in years. Both are doable though

 

[Toprudder]

4198 is a loooong skinny stick powder so I imagine the 4895 would meter better. If that’s a consideration

I use a lot of H4895 but haven’t used 4198 in years. Both are doable though

I will have to go back and compare them, but I seem to remember that 4198 is smaller in size than 4895. I know I have dropped 4198 with my Lee Auto Drum measure with about +/- 0.2gn tolerance. I always use the Chargemaster for 4895 loads.

 

[11B CIB]

I will have to go back and compare them, but I seem to remember that 4198 is smaller in size than 4895. I know I have dropped 4198 with my Lee Auto Drum measure with about +/- 0.2gn tolerance. I always use the Chargemaster for 4895 loads.

IMR4198 is much skinnier but about twice as long as 4895.

 

[Toprudder]

4198 is much skinnier but about twice as long as 4895.

Made me go look.

H4198 on the left, H4895 on the right.

 

[11B CIB]

Made me go look.
View attachment 133446
H4198 on the left, H4895 on the right.

I was talking about IMR4198(I’ll edit my post for the confusion) in the red bottle. Yeah, H4198 is a different animal I guess. Didn’t realize they were that far apart in composition

 

[Toprudder]

Interesting. Lots of confusion with IMR and H versions, I don’t know why they share the same numbers.