Shooting Left: Tale of the "Powder Pattern."

YeeHaa

YeeHaa

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OK,

I sharing the following to get other ideas, suggestions , etc.

New 16", 1:8, 223 Wylde

Cleaned the barrel before use and pulled a rope once or twice at the range.
Ran about 60 rds and it shoots consistently Left and it will group very well.
I was using the same ammo the whole time, from the same lot, etc, etc.
The problem is I don't like it shooting Left, and I mean significantly left like 12" left @ 63yds.

A few days ago I noticed the Powder Pattern on the crown of which possibly tends to explain a great deal.

The bore looks fine as much as I can tell, as does the bore near the crown.

No, the pic is Not Photo Shopped, edited, or was the crown cleaned in that area.

Ideas?

Midway 5r_aa.jpg
 
Powder pattern is odd. Were you shooting without a muzzle device? If it’s shooting well otherwise why not just adjust the sights?
 
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I need some clarification. It sounds like the gun groups well.
Do you need to adjust your sights to POI?
 
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JimB said:
Were you shooting without a muzzle device?
Click to expand...

Used both a Birdcage and a simple open Can Style muzzle Brake

JimB said:
If it’s shooting well otherwise why not just adjust the sights?
Click to expand...

Pink_Vapor said:
It sounds like the gun groups well.
Do you need to adjust your sights to POI.
Click to expand...

Very sound and valid suggestions, and I did adjust the sights & glass.
However for me it's not just a "Little Bit" off, I feel it's a "Lotta Bit" off.
 
BowWow said:
Look at rifling......is it missing a groove?
Click to expand...

+1
From the pattern it does appear to be missing a groove ( or something ) .

I just used much better magnification while back lighting with a bore light and as best I can visually determine the rifling still looks to be in order.

I was starting to wonder if the groove or area in question is in line with the gas port, which is approx .068.
Even if it is in line with the port I don't see how that would be the cause of the pattern as the bullet is well past that point.
 
Off center crown, re-crown and try again. Best to take the crowning tool to the range and make incremental changes as the pattern appears.... It's not unusual to have a "not perfect" crown on a new barrel.....Leave it in the white until you're satisfied....
 
Is the machined hole for the barrel in line with the receiver?
Have you tried a laser bore sight?
Looking down a clean barrel you can see if a barrel is slightly bent via reflections, how's she look?
 
Bailey Boat said:
Off center crown, re-crown and try again. Best to take the crowning tool to the range and make incremental changes as the pattern appears.... It's not unusual to have a "not perfect" crown on a new barrel.....Leave it in the white until you're satisfied....
Click to expand...

Excellent suggestion

I'm going to aggressively clean the bore and go back to the range with a bag of washers and check it again while taking note of ANY changes in POI with different devices.

One thing I'm wondering about is if the crown area becomes slightly deformed with device~s attached ( screwed on ) .

When I was initially zeroing it in I did make windage adjustments ( as usual ) between devices and while I vaguely wondered about the overall final(?) changes at the time I didn't think to much about it.

Days later I checked some things with the rig in question and that's when the copper was visible and I also doubled checked bore alignment to POI compared to iron sights and optics. Comparing to my records of that day, well while it groups good ( excellent ) it's Way Off from bore alignment.

I have experienced rigs shooting Sideways before and the fix or solution has always been different and by far this one is New to me .

The barrel is new and within the manufacture ~ distributors warranty period.
Because of the warranty I am reluctant to permanently modify the barrel.

I have received a RMA for the barrel but if at all possible with resources available to me I want to know why this is happening.
 
YeeHaa said:
Excellent suggestion

I'm going to aggressively clean the bore and go back to the range with a bag of washers and check it again while taking note of ANY changes in POI with different devices.

One thing I'm wondering about is if the crown area becomes slightly deformed with device~s attached ( screwed on ) .

When I was initially zeroing it in I did make windage adjustments ( as usual ) between devices and while I vaguely wondered about the overall final(?) changes at the time I didn't think to much about it.

Days later I checked some things with the rig in question and that's when the copper was visible and I also doubled checked bore alignment to POI compared to iron sights and optics. Comparing to my records of that day, well while it groups good ( excellent ) it's Way Off from bore alignment.

I have experienced rigs shooting Sideways before and the fix or solution has always been different and by far this one is New to me .

The barrel is new and within the manufacture ~ distributors warranty period.
Because of the warranty I am reluctant to permanently modify the barrel.

I have received a RMA for the barrel but if at all possible with resources available to me I want to know why this is happening.
Click to expand...
Do you have a known good barrel you can try in the receiver?
 
Pink_Vapor said:
Is the machined hole for the barrel in line with the receiver?
Click to expand...

+1
I didn't think of that.
I can say that I own a Brownell's AR15 upper lapping tool in which I used on this assembly.
On the lapping tool , I didn't take measurements , however visually I would estimate the upper was out by .0005", or not much.
The BCG also engages the barrel extension very smooth and nice. FWIW, headspace is spot on as well.

Pink_Vapor said:
Have you tried a laser bore sight?
Click to expand...

I own one for 223 and just about every other caliber as well.
Personally I have grown to Not Like them anymore because of battery and just seeing the beam dilemmas. From time to time I still use them at dusk and other than that I sight down the barrel in question including ARs.
Sighting down the barrel of an AR is a little awkward but I find for me it saves my sanity because I can at least see where the barrel is going.

Pink_Vapor said:
Looking down a clean barrel you can see if a barrel is slightly bent via reflections, how's she look?
Click to expand...

I cleaned it again this morning and it looks like a house of mirrors, very clean.
I can't determine if the barrel has a slight slope in it, but I am wondering if a muzzle device screwed on is slightly deforming the crown area.
Later I'm going to clean it with brushes and take it back out and try to find an answer to this.
 
Cleaned the bore 4 times with a bristle and bore cleaner. Followed with patches. Cleaned carbon off muzzle.

I forgot the device it grouped best with, Dah,,,,.

Ran it bare barrel in which it didn't group but pattern which is the same as when I first shot it.

This time I left the Cage on it because it grouped best with it, but not impressive.

The only thing conclusive so far is the scope is 3" off center from the bore axis vs 12" or so.
 
Update,
Over the weekend I submitted my experience & pics of the barrel to the distributor.

Just talked with them, they supplied a call tag and not charging my account for it.

They are replacing the barrel.
 
Update,

I installed a different barrel on the rig and took it out last weekend.
I also ran the same muzzle device that worked the best on the other barrel.

I ran the rifle bare barrel and with the muzzle brake and it is normal meaning that the barrel bore axis and scope alignment are right there and not tweaked into orbit.
BTW, I sighted the bore by looking through it.

The other barrel has been sent back.
 
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