Sobering reality: Gun vs Knife

Sigequinox220

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Great video. These guys have a few other really neat vids. German military I believe. Life style brand (like TRex arms or similar).

anyway, was discussing this topic with @zuerjoha at range today and video came to mind.

looks like 21 feet is where things start to pan out in favor of gun IF getting a good draw. Also looks like he carry’s empty pipe, which is how I most often am carrying. Could get better results from hot carry in sure. But closer than 21 ft you really need to be doing something More dynamic than just drawing weapon.

 
Some bonus topics





Knife vs nothing blows beyond all. While these are unilaterally from the defenders perspective, I don’t imagine “always carry a knife too” would be an improper conclusion to draw. I always do, but I never practice drawing my knife to be honest.
 
looks like he carry’s empty pipe, which is how I most often am carrying.



I am in no way a "John Wick," but you can be damn sure about one thing. Every pistol and rifle that a placed around the house and on me is loaded. I'm not talking about a magazine stuck in the gun. Every one is ready to run. Pull the trigger and "bang."

The only one not ready was bought 3 weeks ago and I'm to lazy to get off my was and drag out the 40cal ammo can.

Get comfortable with knowing that your gun is ready to run by pulling the bang switch. It just may save your life.

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I am in no way a "John Wick," but you can be damn sure about one thing. Every pistol and rifle that a placed around the house and on me is loaded. I'm not talking about a magazine stuck in the gun. Every one is ready to run. Pull the trigger and "bang."

The only one not ready was bought 3 weeks ago and I'm to lazy to get off my was and drag out the 40cal ammo can.

Get comfortable with knowing that your gun is ready to run by pulling the bang switch. It just may save your life.

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If you are taught to treat every gun as if it is loaded, then keep them ALL loaded. I know that all mine are always loaded and ready to fire. I don't want to have to guess which is or which isn't. Either do, or do not. -yoda
 
If you are taught to treat every gun as if it is loaded, then keep them ALL loaded. I know that all mine are always loaded and ready to fire. I don't want to have to guess which is or which isn't. Either do, or do not. -yoda
Yup. They're not going to go off on their own, so putting it in a holster is enough of a safety for me.
 
Great video. These guys have a few other really neat vids. German military I believe. Life style brand (like TRex arms or similar).

anyway, was discussing this topic with @zuerjoha at range today and video came to mind.

looks like 21 feet is where things start to pan out in favor of gun IF getting a good draw. Also looks like he carry’s empty pipe, which is how I most often am carrying. Could get better results from hot carry in sure. But closer than 21 ft you really need to be doing something More dynamic than just drawing weapon.


At Battery Oaks a few months ago, we got a demo on how fast a "regular" guy can cover 21 feet! It sure did shock me, I was not expecting him to move so fast.
 
The most important thing you have to come to terms with if someone attacks you with a knife is that you are going to get cut. Make your peace with that and you will keep your head and come out on top if you have a gun.

Where most people fail in these situations is that they don’t want to be cut so they freak out and try to retreat or block instead of feeding them an arm to cut while they draw and shoot.
 
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The most important thing you have to come to terms with if someone attacks you with a knife is that you are going to get cut. Make your peace with that and you will keep your head and come out on top if you have a gun.

Where most people fail in these situations is that they don’t want to be cut so they freak out and try to retreat or block instead of feeding them an arm to cut while they draw and shoot.
Exactly. I don't use my left arm much, and I want to live more than I want to make a pretty corpse.

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The most important thing you have to come to terms with if someone attacks you with a knife is that you are going to get cut. Make your peace with that and you will keep your head and come out on top if you have a gun.

Where most people fail in these situations is that they don’t want to be cut so they freak out and try to retreat or block instead of feeding them an arm to cut while they draw and shoot.

this is definitely the sum of the sobering reality. If you can’t de-escalate a knife attack, you ARE getting wounded.
 
Why do you think Jim Bowie had his knife designed?

Well one reason was he wanted to be able to reach the vitals on a bear.

But also ...

His comments were “it’s always loaded and it never misfires”.
 
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In addition to being able to cover that 21 feet distance ... I am not counting on my compact carry handgun stopping the threat DRT. Handgun, especially smaller concealed carry types, are not my first choice to stop a threat quickly ... 12 gauge yes ... a 3.5” barreled 9mm like Chad said good chance I’m getting cut if the attacker is hell bent on getting to me.
 
In addition to being able to cover that 21 feet distance ... I am not counting on my compact carry handgun stopping the threat DRT. Handgun, especially smaller concealed carry types, are not my first choice to stop a threat quickly ... 12 gauge yes ... a 3.5” barreled 9mm like Chad said good chance I’m getting cut if the attacker is hell bent on getting to me.

Yup...once Mr. Badguy goes full on choppy chop, you will poke some holes in him, but he is still coming for you.


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The most important thing you have to come to terms with if someone attacks you with a knife is that you are going to get cut. Make your peace with that and you will keep your head and come out on top if you have a gun.

Where most people fail in these situations is that they don’t want to be cut so they freak out and try to retreat or block instead of feeding them an arm to cut while they draw and shoot.

I was at Smokey Mountain Knife works once shopping for a machete. I asked the guy next to me if he knew anything about machete’s. He said nope. But he said he knew about knife fights. I said what do you know about knife fights? He said everybody bleeds. :eek:
 
That 2nd video of knife vs. empty hands had all kinds of "wtf" moments from me. I understand they kinda had set angles set up, as far as slashing/stabbing/thrusting goes, but watching the slow mo, you could see the guy with the blade was not fully committed a bunch of times. And i like how the one said no injury, when he took a direct stab to the top of the thigh. Do that with the attacker using a red sharpie, and you'll see exactly what I mean, you'll have red marks all over you. We also have a shock knife if anyone would like to try and see how that pans out in empty hands/force on force goes. I've also done a bunch of the gun disarms like the first of those bonus videos has, and some people are way faster than others obviously. Man, this makes me want to hold some classes again in knife/empty hands/airsoft. Fun times.
 
Man, this makes me want to hold some classes again in knife/empty hands/airsoft. Fun times.
Let me know when you do.

+ Is a "shock knife" one that actually shocks you, like a stun gun or something?
 
Let me know when you do.

+ Is a "shock knife" one that actually shocks you, like a stun gun or something?
Yes, it actually shocks you when it touches you.
Watch this video, and around 2:28 you can see it shock the guy.
 
All I'm gather is that I should go ahead and draw on anybody I don't know within 20ft of me. I'm fine with that, but it should make Walmart trips more interesting.

Remember: shots on target at 19 feet.
 
I do not see why the message should just be about knives. It should be about any weapon including guns, hands, feet, teeth, clubs, rocks, handful of sand, or anything else that a person can carry that can be used against another person. As Tailhunter wrote above, action beats reaction. The aggressor knows when he is going to begin his aggressive actions and could be just as successful with a variety of weapons. The reactor would be just as disadvantaged if he had a knife instead of a gun. It takes about the same amount of time to dray and fire a handgun as it does to draw and stab/slash with a knife. The person who gets a weapon into play first generally has a decided advantage.
 
The most important thing you have to come to terms with if someone attacks you with a knife is that you are going to get cut. Make your peace with that and you will keep your head and come out on top if you have a gun.

Where most people fail in these situations is that they don’t want to be cut so they freak out and try to retreat or block instead of feeding them an arm to cut while they draw and shoot.
Nothing wrong with backpeddling a few steps while drawing. I don't think I'd want to extend my left arm while firimg with my right.
 
Great video. These guys have a few other really neat vids. German military I believe. Life style brand (like TRex arms or similar).

anyway, was discussing this topic with @zuerjoha looks like he carry’s empty pipe, which is how I most often am carrying.
If I carried a Sig striker, the pipe would be empty as well! :p

I used too as well when I had younger kids living at home. They didn't have the strength to rack the slide. By the time they did, they were proficient at safety and using a Glock.
 
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If I carried a Sig striker, the pipe would be empty as well! :p

I used too as well when I had younger kids living at home. They didn't have the strength to rack the slide. By the time they did, they were proficient at safety and using a Glock.

Bingo. not being able to rack the slide reduces probability of AD/ND to ZERO, which is a very rare probability with most things in life. So for now, the trade off is favorable to me. To those saying useful as a brick, id ask how quickly they can convert a brick into a tool that shoots lead projectiles at 1200 ft per second. For me, with my 'brick' its about 0.3 seconds. Im okay with that. I've always been a strong advocate of the mantra: "Always bring Tupperware to a gun/knife fight". a 'brick' is very generous description of my Glock, ha.
 
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Most knife attacks occur much closer and with less warning than a person attempting a banzai move from afar. Training yourself for defense against the OP's video circumstances would be better spent learning how to recognise danger and what to do to evade such.
 
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Defensively you're always at the disadvantage as the attacker has already decided to attack and you're trying to react and catch up. That's why you should try to put a barrier between you.

CD
Absolutely...there is No reason to believe that your attacker will start 7 yards away. He will more than likely be within arm's reach!
At Battery Oaks a few months ago, we got a demo on how fast a "regular" guy can cover 21 feet! It sure did shock me, I was not expecting him to move so fast.
Old Fat folks 2 1/2 secs......young agile folks 1 1/2 secs. That is your survival time within 7 yards. They don't come with that big of an advantage. They'll be standing beside you!
All I'm gather is that I should go ahead and draw on anybody I don't know within 20ft of me. I'm fine with that, but it should make Walmart trips more interesting.
Therein lies the rub....the attacker always has the advantage.
Nothing wrong with backpeddling a few steps while drawing.
Most knife attacks occur much closer and with less warning than a person attempting a banzai move from afar.
Both damn good points....

Remember the Triad...Alertness......A Plan.....A weapon...in that order. I will not be caught in "white" outside the Gates...Distance is my friend......Sig 365...……..My Triad. We must all seek our own salvation....
 
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