Triangle Shooting Academy update from Bill

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Prodiver

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Folks, I woke up this morning and checked the boards, and wow, what a tornado!

Here is what happened: we had a staff meeting last Tuesday, and made the decision to not allow people to walk in with uncased firearms. This includes open carry. In the past, open carry was fine with the slides locked back but we have had too many incidents with this not being followed. Many times folks are looking for a new holster, and remove their handgun to try it out. And many times loaded guns have been pointed at our employees and guests unintentionally. We did have a ND at the range counter, on video, totally the fault of the guest. Fortunately no one was hurt.

The Concealed Carry policy has not changed. When the revised policy was posted on the TSA site, it was erroneously posted with a restriction on Concealed Handguns. This policy has not changed. Concealed carry is allowed, but must remain concealed at all times and cannot be used on the range. If you intend to use your concealed carry on the range, it must be unloaded and cased before entering the building.

The policy is only directed at uncased firearms. Far too many uncased firearms enter the facility and make guests uncomfortable. All firearms entering the facility to be used on the range, or to be taken to the gunsmith, or taken for appraisal, must be unloaded and cased.

We appreciate your comments, and bringing this to our attention. As always, we are primarily interested in being a safe place to shoot.

Thanks,

Bill
 
Hi Bill,

First of all, welcome to the forum.

Second. This was erroneous?

Screenshot_20170729-114943.jpg

Or was it correct, and the policy is changing after the backlash? Just curious.

Will the staff not be open carrying either? I asked in the other thread but figure this is more direct.
 
As a businessman I can fully understand your concerns. I most likely would not frequent your business if concealed carry was prohibited. Keep that in mind if the concealed part changes. A policy that no gun be taken out of a holster or bag outside the range station would be perfect logic for the safety of guest and employees. Most of the posters here assume everyone is knowledgeable on firearm safety and has lots of exposure to guns. This is not true.

I believe most view your policies much like a posted restaurant but I see it differently. Even bagged guns can be loaded and discharged so the no firearm touched without staff assistance outside a range station would be more in line with safety and customer relations. I am not in your area it really doesn't affect me but remember this always:

Perception Is Reality- what the individual perceives is their individual reality, fact or not fact.
 
Prodiver said:
Folks, I woke up this morning and checked the boards, and wow, what a tornado!
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You check the boards but only decide to join to control the damage? Welcome to the forum. I hope you decide to stay and become an active member.
 
BurnedOutGeek said:
Hi Bill,

First of all, welcome to the forum.

Second. This was erroneous?

View attachment 17276

Or was it correct, and the policy is changing after the backlash? Just curious.

Will the staff not be open carrying either? I asked in the other thread but figure this is more direct.
Click to expand...
I agree that if guest and employees are concerned about open carry then staff should also not carry. I wear steel toe boots AND require employees to adhere. It would be wrong not to have a policy followed by all. Staff are not above having accidents if this is the case.
 
BlackGun said:
I agree that if guest and employees are concerned about open carry then staff should also not carry. I wear steel toe boots AND require employees to adhere. It would be wrong not to have a policy followed by all. Staff are not above having accidents if this is the case.
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And we all have a story about a staff member at a gun shop.
 
BurnedOutGeek said:
Hi Bill,

First of all, welcome to the forum.

Second. This was erroneous?

View attachment 17283

Or was it correct, and the policy is changing after the backlash? Just curious.

Will the staff not be open carrying either? I asked in the other thread but figure this is more direct.
Click to expand...

It was done in error by our employee that mis understood.

All employees that want to carry are trained before doing so.

Thanks, Bill
 
Prodiver said:
It was done in error by our employee that mis understood.

All employees that want to carry are trained before doing so.

Thanks, Bill
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Nobody but this one employee read the statement before it went public?

What training might this be that covers them? After all this policy was made to make the clients in the store feel more comfortable.

It's your place, and therefore your rules. Trust me, we get that. There are those of that when we see something that just doesn't align with our beliefs will show that with our wallet and our feet, but would really like to have the full picture first.
 
Prodiver said:
All employees that want to carry are trained before doing so.

Thanks, Bill
Click to expand...

The being swept by a muzzle by an employee shouldn't happen. And has happened to me.

I don't and haven't visited often. But this statement will ensure I don't visit in the future.
 
There was a reply to a post on Facebook ...
Well, we support 2a of course. But we allow no loaded firearms except on the range. Most of our staff is armed and fully trained. We practice for active shooters and are always on guard for your safety. We have 2 Navy Seals, and multiple law enforcement officers always looking out for your safety. All guests at our range are under scrutiny at all times.
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... there was no reference regarding Concealed Carry still being as is in this reply last night.

It is sad to say but sure looks like TSA has grown to a point where the more season firearms owners gets put off by the red tape needed because of the fact many with lesser knowledge, training and experience make up more and more of your customer base. The success and growth of TSA as a business may require tighter rules than some of us here are willing to be subject to. It kinda sucks with your next phase adding the 100 yard rifle lanes which I was thinking would be great for load development until I was told no chronograph, even my MagnetoSpeed, or with some overzealous ROs who even are looking over your shoulder when just sighting in an optic on a pistol. I understand safety is needed but most here are pretty independent thinking and I for one am put off more each time something like this happens.

Wish you and TSA well but the environment seems to being heading a way I don't want to go ... good luck.
 
LeeMajors said:
The being swept by a muzzle by an employee shouldn't happen. And has happened to me.

I don't and haven't visited often. But this statement will ensure I don't visit in the future.
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Exactly what happened to me as well. I had not seen a g43, there wasn't any in stock, another guy was apparently doing the same so the sales guy at the counter pulled his out to show. Swept at least 4 people in the process.
 
So I just got an update email from TSA as I'm sure all members did. I am very happy they decided to modify yesterday's policy. Email is below, and thanks to everyone who spoke up I think it caused the change. For me personally, this will make me happy enough for now to be able to at least conceal carry on prem. Thanks to all who spoke up, and yes, thanks to their management who listened.


Members and Guests,
Our number one goal is safety for our guests and staff. With this in mind, yesterday Triangle Shooting Academy released a new store policy in regards to carrying firearms in the facility. Since then we have received numerous responses from both our members and the public with concern to these new policies. Triangle Shooting Academy welcomes and values all of our guest's feedback.

Triangle Shooting Academy allows concealed carry in the facility. We ask that if you do conceal carry that it remains concealed while in the building. This means that if you want to shoot on the range with your concealed carry firearm, you must bring it into the facility in a case rather than concealed on your person. We ask that while in our retail store you do not retrieve your concealed firearm for any reason. We understand that it may be tempting to retrieve your firearm when sizing holsters or fitting a magazine but we ask that it stays in a concealed position at all times. In the event that you do need a holster please bring the firearm in unloaded, in a case.

We require all other firearms to be empty and in a case. At Triangle Shooting Academy we define a case as anything that is designed to carry or cover a firearm. (i.e. hard case, soft case, range bags, gun sock.) The policy does not allow for any type of open carry. In the past, we have allowed firearms to be in a holster as long as the magazine was removed and the slide was locked open. In some cases, this led to manipulation of the firearm. As a safety precaution, we can no longer allow this.

As Triangle Shooting Academy continues to grow, our number one goal is always the safety of everyone. Thank you for your understanding and cooperation.
Sincerely,

Triangle Shooting Academy
 
I'm just curious where all these local ranges are getting all these SEALs that the Navy seems to be hemorrhaging. Seems like every place you go to has a staff full of SEALs, Delta, Force Recon, SAS, GIGN, etc.

Teaching Basic Pistol Marksmanship, Basic Carbine, and how to make a bugout bag.

In my mind, that's a pretty small community in general, even after the increases seen since 2001. I just don't particularly see the local gun shop teaching new gun folks stuff being that kind of lure from the SF community.
 
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SPM said:
I'm just curious where all these local ranges are getting all these SEALs that the Navy seems to be hemorrhaging. Seems like every place you go to has a staff full of SEALs, Delta, Force Recon, SAS, GIGN, etc.

Teaching Basic Pistol Marksmanship, Basic Carbine, and how to make a buyout bag.

In my mind, that's a pretty small community in general, even after the increases seen since 2001. I just don't particularly see the local gun shop teaching new gun folks stuff being that kind of lure from the SF community.
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Can I just identify as one and have it count?
 
I'm a responsible gun owner and a member of TSA. I'm also a gun advocate and just like their shirt says "Educate, Advocate, Train". I'm sorry Bill, but I don't see how this is advocate. If anything, this sends the wrong message to all those anti-gun business owners that show their political bias by posting the little "No Firearms" in their window. How is this different?

Look I get it. Safety first. Then how can we fault the anti-gunner for doing similar?
 
BurnedOutGeek said:
Based on that email (the way I'm reading anyway) is that it wasn't in error and that seeing their members and the public pushback may have changed their policy.

Like I said, that's how I read it anyway...
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Error= plausible deniability
 
BurnedOutGeek said:
Can I just identify as one and have it count?
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Why not?

White people can identify as black.

Women can identify as men (or vice versa).

Hell, people identify as dragons, or cats, or owls.

Maybe I will self identify as Thor, God of Thunder and request, no demand people use my pronoun - and force business to build bathrooms for the divine or else cry discrimination.
 
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I do not mean to be a militant type but the email, the 1st response to the Facebook criticism and such seemed to point to the idea of no conceal carry but with the backlash of "another slice of the cake" being taken away from our gun rights the management backpedaled quickly. I appreciate TSA is going to allow those that spent their money there to learn and train and after this "clarification" to practice it in TSA again ... hope no more slices get taken.
 
Not being able to carry concealed (and loaded), use that firearm on the range, then reload and reholster before I leave the range portion of the facility, is pointless.
 
wsfiredude said:
But they have trained people there pertectin you.
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Right. My concern is their level of training is equivalent to the CHP training they staunchly defend. Which my wife scored a perfect score on the second time she ever fired a pistol (and the first time she'd ever even seen that particular model)...and has never carried or even shot another firearm since her class. :eek::confused:
 
No concealed weapon on site at a gun range or open carry is some funny shyte. Can you image CNN showing up and doing a story on Even Gun Ranges in Raleigh Don't Allow People to Carry on property. And you guys are mad about restaurants? Hahahaha. Even funnier is the staff carrying to protect against a possible carrier but you can't. Hahahaha.
 
I can fully understand a policy of no uncased weapons UNLESS they are holstered and no unholstering or uncasing any weapon inside the store (which should apply equally to employees).

But the rest is ridiculous BS.

The new rule won't prevent an idiot from acting like an idiot any more than a gun buster sign will prevent a criminal from acting like a criminal.
 
If safety is the actual goal, then a few signs placed strategically around the shop in big letters saying

"Hey dumbass. Yeah you. Do not uncase or unholster your weapon for any reason inside this store or you will be removed and banned for life. Unless we're being robbed then aim carefully."
 
I think you fellas are being a little hard on TSA. They have a business to run and it's open to the public; it's different from a private range. They can train their employees, but everyone who comes through the door is not going to be as careful as you are. Some guys may come in all amped up to shoot, excited or maybe a little nervous. Put yourself in their shoes - if TSA has a serious accident, they could be out of business; they have to protect the business. Bill has stated that concealed carry is OK as long as it remains concealed. His policy is not unreasonable for a public business. Don't like it? Go someplace you like; but no need to beat up someone who is offering a service *that we want*, at no small risk. I'm not a member and haven't even shot there (yet), but I have run a business and it ain't as easy as it looks. We need all the ranges we can get, and TSA is a pretty nice one. I'm cutting them some slack on this.
 
Red Marley said:
Don't like it? Go someplace you like...
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I did. Which is too bad. I took my wife there and got our range cards last year. It was her first time shooting, ever. She had an excellent experience.

Fast forward a few months. I walk in to have lunch at the cafe, meet a friend from here, try out a new pea shooter I had recently bought to see where the bullets go. (I seem to keep having to tell this story.) They wouldn't sell me a $3 bottle of gun oil without my name, or range card.

I don't really care about the gun oil, but I assume you can't buy ammo there either without giving them a name. I don't give my freaking name when I buy ammo, and certainly not for gun oil. I'm 61 years old so we're all pretty sure I'm old enough. It's nobody's business, unless I enlist the use of a credit card, then a third party is involved. I have a good friend here who had an identical experience on a pricey pile of rifle parts, none of which required a 4473.

They don't seem to be dialed into the mindset of your typical liberty minded, privacy loving, gun owner.
 
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BurnedOutGeek said:
Hi Bill,

First of all, welcome to the forum.

Second. This was erroneous?

View attachment 17283

Or was it correct, and the policy is changing after the backlash? Just curious.

Will the staff not be open carrying either? I asked in the other thread but figure this is more direct.
Click to expand...

My guess is the latter.
 
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