Type 54/TT-33 Tokarev Pistols

Combat Diver

Combat Diver

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While neither are a correct Russian TT-33, these are copies. Top is a commercial Chinese M20 (Type 54) pistol and bottom is a Khyber Pass local workshop gun where parts are hand made around the magazine. Waiting for the magazine to come back and since I've got little less then 20 rounds of 7.62x25 ammo, I'll do a range report on the M20. These gun replaced the Russian Nagant Revolver and TT-30 in Soviet service in the 1930s and standard pistol thru WWII. National China copy it. It was replaced by the Pistol Makarov in Soviet service.

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CD
 
Man, the "Khyber Pass" guns you've posted are ... interesting, to say the least!

Wood carvers & fishmongers can opt for a cut-resistant glove. Is there an armorers equivalent, or is it just the ol' C-clamp & looong string method? :)

Another cool CD post, thanks!
 
Thanks for sharing. The TT-33/M-20 is weird. Note the slide serrations are the scalloped type earlier Soviet TT-33 pistols had. In 1947 they changed them to the simpler serrated style. When Russian production ended with 1952 dated pistols they manufactured a batch for China with the same late slide serrations and then licensed the Chinese to produce their own similar copies. Every picture I've seen of Chinese TT-33 pistols and everyone I have handled all had the late pattern slide serrations.

A big clue as to the origins of the top pistol in the pictures has to do with the photo of the top of the slide. The "11" inside a circle is a Polish Radom arsenal marking. The Polish TT-33s also used the earlier scalloped slide serrations such as the M-20 in the picture has. Could it be that the Chinese were reusing recycled Polish parts or complete pistols? Another possibility is that it is also a "Khyber Pass" copy. Notice how small the grips are? Lots of mystery here! If there is time, a disassembly in detail might clear up the matter. Anyway, that's just a thought. Regards!
 
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Henry Brown said:
Thanks for sharing. The TT-33/M-20 is weird. Note the slide serrations are the scalloped type earlier Soviet TT-33 pistols had. In 1947 they changed them to the simpler serrated style. When Russian production ended with 1952 dated pistols they manufactured a batch for China with the same late slide serrations and then licensed the Chinese to produce their own similar copies. Every picture I've seen of Chinese TT-33 pistols and everyone I have handled all had the late pattern slide serrations.

A big clue as to the origins of the top pistol in the pictures has to do with the photo of the top of the slide. The "11" inside a circle is a Polish Radom arsenal marking. The Polish TT-33s also used the earlier scalloped slide serrations such as the M-20 in the picture has. Could it be that the Chinese were reusing recycled Polish parts or complete pistols? If there is time, a disassembly in detail might clear up the matter. Anyway, that's just a thought. Regards!
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I noticed the circle 11 but Radom code is in a oval not circle. Interesting idea on the slides however.

CD
 
Just before your quote I went back and edited the post to suggest the possibility that the "M-20" may itself be a "Khyber Pass" copy. It is hard to tell on the outside. In my experience with these copies the outside looks good enough to fool a buyer initially, but a check of the internals reveals a lot of hand work with few squared angles on any parts. I would respectfully suggest you find out who made it before firing. The powder used in the Darra region ammunition is made using recycled film stock and is rather weak compared to normal arsenal produced cartridge pressures. Cheers, Henry
 
I broke the gun down yesterday and its all machined worked on the inside. No hand fitted parts as I've seen on two other Khyber Pass guns. Still don't get the "Made as China". Few days ago got a Beretta 92FS copy made in Pakistan too. Doing a report on that one later with lots of pictures with a US M9 to compare. Here's a picture of the back of the slide/frame. Firing pin is centered, not oblong. Trigger group bars are squared and frame/slide rails are machined and not hand filed. Face of the breech indicates lots of red primer paint.

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CD
 
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You know your stuff. That pistol was definitely not hand filed out of railroad scrap by some talented fellow sitting on his haunches!
 
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Henry Brown said:
The powder used in the Darra region ammunition is made using recycled film stock and is rather weak compared to normal arsenal produced cartridge pressures.
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Fascinating tidbit!

I've used a penny dropped in nitric acid as a propellant, but that will only work in a potato cannon.
 
Breakdown of the Norinco marked pistol. Notice no manual safety per US import laws, follows original pattern to include the slide serrations. Bushing was very tight and had to use pliers to grab to twist. With the "Made as China" and caliber listed as .30 Bore and dated 66 (too pristine for a original 1966 dated Type 54) and Circle 11 thinking this is one of the higher quality of Pakistani guns.
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CD
 
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Frames comparison. I did try and match the different frames/slides together and no go.
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CD
 
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Barrels. Now have the two that came with the slide/frames plus a third Tok barrel that I found in my spare AK parts bin that someone left years ago. The third barrel will not fit into either slide but the other two will mix. Notice use of the bar for a swinging link/recoil spring guide on the Khyber Pass. Possibly Russian proof on the other spare barrel. All three chambered for 7.62x25mm.

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Trigger group, slide stop, bushing and slide stop clip. Trigger group and bushing will not fit in other gun.
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CD
 
Thanks for the detailed discussion and pics. The trigger pack is definitely too rough for a Chinese manufacture in my opinion. I believe that you are correct in that that barrel on the bottom of the picture is indeed a Soviet Russian one. Neat find! Henry
 
Henry Brown said:
Thanks for the detailed discussion and pics. The trigger pack is definitely too rough for a Chinese manufacture in my opinion. I believe that you are correct in that that barrel on the bottom of the picture is indeed a Soviet Russian one. Neat find! Henry
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Thinking this Norinco marked gun is a Pakistani gun.

CD
 
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