We Are Slaves

Chdamn

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We are slaves to debt.

When I was growing up (born in 1973) the average household was maintained with a single income.

The average US income on 1973 was a little over $7,500 a year. Upper middle class was anyone making over $40,000 a year.

Today, my wife and I, together, make six figures and I would put us at a solid middle class. Her car is 7 years old, my truck is 14 years old, our son goes to public school and our household budget for food is almost $1,000 a month. Our home was purchased 10 years ago for around $100,000.

We do not live a lavish lifestyle. But our household budget is almost double the entire average yearly income from 1973.

What the hell is going on in this country?

I’ll tell you what’s going on. The government, with the support of the multinational banking system, has repeatedly bailed out the elite by printing more and more money with zero precious metal backing.

I can’t do the math but we are drowning in inflation to the point that we are slaves to debt. Little worker bees that continue to produce to feed the queen (or king as it may be).

That type of hive can only continue to function so long as:

A: The drones arr blind to the fact they are being used.

B: All the drones are working and unproductive bees are pushed from the hive to perish because they cannot maintain themselves.

—————————————————————

B: Today we have millions of unproductive bees feeding off of the honey that the drones have produced.

A: I am hoping like hell the drones are awakening to the fact that we are being used.

If the drones could get it together long enough to realize they don’t need a queen and push her ass out of the hive, along with the unproductive drones, the hive would be much healthier.
 
You running for office I don't know about? Preach it brother!!! Lol DS

I feel personally attacked. Lol.

Not at all. I’m a patriot that is simply pissed off at the state of our union.

I’m am absolutely pissed off at the state of our union.

I am tired of busting my ass for 50 to 60 hours a week, and watching my wife do the same, just so we can afford to live less comfortably than I did as a child while my father made less that we do combined.

I’m tired of watching our republic be torn apart to make way for the new, and better, democratic communism.

I‘m desperately seeking men, who refuse to wear pantyhose, to start banding together to reclaim our magna encarta inspired form of government, before it’s too damn late.
 
You were a lot more fun when you were a lot less serious...

I‘m desperately seeking men, who refuse to wear pantyhose, to start banding together to reclaim our magna encarta inspired form of government, before it’s too damn late.
Asking for a friend - my friend can still wear them if he wants, right? he doesn't like being kink shamed
 
I feel personally attacked. Lol.

Not at all. I’m a patriot that is simply pissed off at the state of our union.

I’m am absolutely pissed off at the state of our union.

I am tired of busting my ass for 50 to 60 hours a week, and watching my wife do the same, just so we can afford to live less comfortably than I did as a child while my father made less that we do combined.

I’m tired of watching our republic be torn apart to make way for the new, and better, democratic communism.

I‘m desperately seeking men, who refuse to wear pantyhose, to start banding together to reclaim our magna encarta inspired form of government, before it’s too damn late.

Nail on head sir and you're speaking for quite a few people who are looking for the same........sadly I'm afraid that it would surprise all of us how many people want exactly the opposite of this.

When decision time comes I don't want them in my circle. Period
 
Its been going on a looooooong time. People just dont want to see it. This video explains it pretty well but nobody will watch it.

 
I feel personally attacked. Lol.

Not at all. I’m a patriot that is simply pissed off at the state of our union.

I’m am absolutely pissed off at the state of our union.

I am tired of busting my ass for 50 to 60 hours a week, and watching my wife do the same, just so we can afford to live less comfortably than I did as a child while my father made less that we do combined.

I’m tired of watching our republic be torn apart to make way for the new, and better, democratic communism.

I‘m desperately seeking men, who refuse to wear pantyhose, to start banding together to reclaim our magna encarta inspired form of government, before it’s too damn late.

Your problem is that you are more perceptive than most. You are supposed to simply work more, make less and STFU. What is wrong with you?
 
You running for office I don't know about? Preach it brother!!! Lol

Something WE ALL need to DEMAND is term limits!!!! Term limits on our Congressmen and senators! No more than 8 years, 2 four year terms.


DS

You forgot federal and supreme court justices.
 
Well, you can choose to participate in the madness at the lowest level possible.

No consumer debt.
Cars paid for.
Mortgage is manageable.
No big impulse purchases.
Emergency fund to keep you away from the credit card.
Tweak your taxes so they can't bleed you dry during the year and just settle up with what you owe when you file. You can claim all the dependents you want on your check. You only have to prove them when you file your taxes.
 
Your problem is that you are more perceptive than most.
Lotsa folks are just as perceptive. This is a growing frustration. The measure of whether "most" are as perceptive comes in November.

But the fix is far more complicated than term limits and POTUS.
 
I’ll tell you what’s going on. The government, with the support of the multinational banking system, has repeatedly bailed out the elite by printing more and more money with zero precious metal backing.

This is from April. Note for paltry amount of “stimulus” and the fraud of the big corporations sucking up the small amount reserved for small businesses, Uncle Jerome handed his hedge fund cronies TRILLIONS by buying up their bad bets AT PROFIT. Covid 19 was used as cover for the greatest wealth transfer, or rather theft, in history. Folks, there is no voting your way out of this, and it is CRIMINAL.

fed_balance.jpg
 
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness."


DS
 
We are slaves to debt.

When I was growing up (born in 1973) the average household was maintained with a single income.

The average US income on 1973 was a little over $7,500 a year. Upper middle class was anyone making over $40,000 a year.

Today, my wife and I, together, make six figures and I would put us at a solid middle class. Her car is 7 years old, my truck is 14 years old, our son goes to public school and our household budget for food is almost $1,000 a month. Our home was purchased 10 years ago for around $100,000.

We do not live a lavish lifestyle. But our household budget is almost double the entire average yearly income from 1973.

What the hell is going on in this country?

I’ll tell you what’s going on. The government, with the support of the multinational banking system, has repeatedly bailed out the elite by printing more and more money with zero precious metal backing.

I can’t do the math but we are drowning in inflation to the point that we are slaves to debt. Little worker bees that continue to produce to feed the queen (or king as it may be).

That type of hive can only continue to function so long as:

A: The drones arr blind to the fact they are being used.

B: All the drones are working and unproductive bees are pushed from the hive to perish because they cannot maintain themselves.

—————————————————————

B: Today we have millions of unproductive bees feeding off of the honey that the drones have produced.

A: I am hoping like hell the drones are awakening to the fact that we are being used.

If the drones could get it together long enough to realize they don’t need a queen and push her ass out of the hive, along with the unproductive drones, the hive would be much healthier.

I understand the sentiment but lets look at the numbers surrounding your household income. On the surface the numbers are stunning but when you look at them through inflation not just as raw numbers they make more sense. One question I have is when you say your household budget is 2X the annual avg income from 1973 are you talking about your monthly budget or your annual budget? If you are talking annual you are doing an awesome job holding down expenses. If you are talking monthly that is a different story but at the same time not completely out of wack. Stick with me for a minute.

The median house hold income in 1973 was $12,051 according to the census. Now take that and adjust for inflation. That means in today's $$$ that person was making $69,970.98. Also you have to look deeper into the numbers. The median salary for a white male working a full time year round job in 1973 was $8060. Again adjusted for inflation that is $46,798. So if you and your wife are making just over 6 figures you are about the equivalent of $12,051 in 1973. 2020 median income is estimated to be $78,500 so you are better off them most. Clearly not where you want to be any I would assume not where you should be.

Inflation is an issue but it is not the giant elephant in the room. Our overall cumulative rate of inflation which is a compounding number between 1973 and 2020 is about 480.6%. On its face it seems insane but in a healthy functioning economy you need a certain amount of inflation. You cannot have growth without inflation. Too much inflation is bad and 0 inflation or deflation is even worse. You talk about unproductive bees. Before the pandemic we had a unemployment rate of 3.8% in FEB 2020. It was considered full employment. Sure there are people sucking on the tit but historically there were less than at other times. The real problem is not that less people work it is that more people work for less money. Wages have not kept up with inflation. Today in order to have the same purchasing power that someone making minimum wage in 1973 had you need to make $9.63 an hour. In order to have the same purchasing power as the median household in 1973 you need to make $23.26 an hour assuming a 40 hr work week.

Wages have not kept up with inflation. Our current minimum wage when you account for inflation is paying less today than it did in 1973. Today you can get paid $7.25 an hour. This is the starting point for wage earners. In the current economy before the pandemic when we had nearly "Full Employment" we had way too many people earning less than minimum wage workers in 1973. To me the problem is not people who don't work. There have been people who did not contribute "work" into the economy at every point in our history it is that too many people do not earn enough money to contribute in a meaningful way. Someone making $15 is never going to make it on their own in this economy yet we can pay someone less than half of that.

This is what leads directly to the debit that so many individual have. It is not that they are inherently lazy, stupid or unwilling. Sure there are tons of people who fall into that category but there have always been those people in the economy. That is not something new. Wage stagnation is what is causing the massive consumer debt we have today. People need a car to get to work. Without a car you can't work. They do not make enough to live and save to pay cash for a car so they take a loan. It is a catch 22. In order to earn they have to take on debt which eats into their earnings and potential savings. This is what is at the heart of the problem not Fiat currency and a non reliance on the gold standard. If the US was on the gold standard there would be less inflation but there would be no growth. How can you have growth when the amount of wealth in the world is a fixed amount? You can't. Now the major bailouts that politicians from both sides have been handing out for decades only compound the problems. They kick the can down the road for the immediately benefit of the 1% of the 1% and push the burden onto the avg person and the avg persons kids kids. Its total BS.

I agree the drones need to wake up. I think they need to realize that their labor is worth more than they are being paid. The American worker has been selling $20 for $10 for decades and it is killing the avg family in this country. If it is not putting them underwater it is certainly not allowing them to accumulate wealth or get ahead in life. To me the real question is who are the Queens that need to be kicked out of the hive and do the drones who are by their nature drones have the ability to run and grow the hive? If you intend to replace the Queen tread carefully.
 
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About the furthest thing from an economist, but I was under the impression that our purchasing power, today, is about identical to 1974. Not higher or lower, but essentially identical.
https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-ta...rs-real-wages-have-barely-budged-for-decades/

And we have much better tech. Better air conditioning, better entertainment(tv/movies/internet). More reliable cars. GPS, smartphones, PCs, internet.

That's before my time, but if I could choose to live in '73 or live now, I'd choose now. Yeah, in 1880 Britain, most people could afford a maid. But you also lived in a smog ridden city and had no flushing toilets.

Do we need to increase our purchasing power, lower prices? Yeah, I'd like that. But I don't think it's as doom and gloom as being portrayed and, since we are in the process of divesting from China, I expect to see prices bump up for 2-3 years before alternative production facilities are made.

Yeah, I'd like to make more, and have that money worth more. But I live frugally, keep debts low, and invest a ton(because Social Security will be bankrupt by the time I retire). Don't see what I can do to improve things, beyond improving my skills to make me more income mobile.
 
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The idea that inflation is necessary is a folly of a poor economic theory that has done more to increase the gap between the elite and the middle class. It is a game used by the central banking system to keep most people from ever getting out of debt.

Printing money without having an actual, real and tangible value backing it is the primary cause of inflation.

And having a minimum wage that is increased on occasion is also a factor of inflation that actually does more harm than good. When you force companies to pay people more that their menial, entry level job deserves that increase the labor costs for the product or service they are selling.

Companies, which are beholden to their share holders to make a consistent profit, are not going to absorb that cost, nor should they. So the cost of those goods and services will increase to compensate. That has happened every single time the minimum wage has increased.

Who really gets hurt in a minimum wage increase are the people who are currently performing at a higher level and making the rate the minimum wage will be increased to. If a guy is making $10 an hour now and they increase the min wage from $7-$10 no employer is going to move all of his $10 an hour employees to $13.

I honestly don’t have time right now to debate Keynesian vs Austrian economics but I’m sure someone will step in.
 
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If the drones could get it together long enough to realize they don’t need a queen and push her ass out of the hive, along with the unproductive drones, the hive would be much healthier.

You are on fire today, boss! Preach, brother!
 
The idea that inflation is necessary is a folly of a poor economic theory that has done more to increase the gap between the elite and the middle class. It is a game used by the central banking system to keep most people from ever getting out of debt.

Printing money without having an actual, real and tangible value backing it is the primary cause of inflation.

And having a minimum wage that is increased on occasion is also a factor of inflation that actually does more harm than good. When you force companies to pay people more that their menial, entry level job deserves that increase the labor costs for the product or service they are selling.

Companies, which are beholden to their share holders to make a consistent profit, are not going to absorb that cost, nor should they. So the cost of those goods and services will increase to compensate. That has happened every single time the minimum wage has increased.

Who really gets hurt in a minimum wage increase are the people who are currently performing at a higher level and making the rate the minimum wage will be increased to. If a guy is making $10 an hour now and they increase the min wage from $7-$10 no employer is going to move all of his $10 an hour employees to $13.

I honestly don’t have time right now to debate Keynesian vs Austrian economics but I’m sure someone will step in.

If you look at the numbers you are better off than you were when you were a child assuming your father made the median income of a white male in 1973. You may have more demands on your money but the numbers say you are ahead even if you don't feel like you are.

Your wages will stagnate unless there is a fundamental shift in the nature of your employment because the overall there is wage deflation. Have you ever considered that you are getting paid exactly what the free market thinks you are worth? The company you work for pays you what they deem correct so that they make a profit which flows to direct owners or shareholders.

I do not understand how on the low end of the wage scale you want the natural order of things but when you move up the food chain to the middle class you want a different economic pay scale. Seems contradictory to me.

So revolution and tearing down the entire system is really your answer?
 
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About the furthest thing from an economist, but I was under the impression that our purchasing power, today, is about identical to 1974. Not higher or lower, but essentially identical.
https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-ta...rs-real-wages-have-barely-budged-for-decades/

And we have much better tech. Better air conditioning, better entertainment(tv/movies/internet). More reliable cars. GPS, smartphones, PCs, internet.

That's before my time, but if I could choose to live in '73 or live now, I'd choose now. Yeah, in 1880 Britain, most people could afford a maid. But you also lived in a smog ridden city and had no flushing toilets.

Do we need to increase our purchasing power, lower prices? Yeah, I'd like that. But I don't think it's as doom and gloom as being portrayed and, since we are in the process of divesting from China, I expect to see prices bump up for 2-3 years before alternative production facilities are made.

Yeah, I'd like to make more, and have that money worth more. But I live frugally, keep debts low, and invest a ton(because Social Security will be bankrupt by the time I retire). Don't see what I can do to improve things, beyond improving my skills to make me more income mobile.

We may be more comfortable today but that doesn’t mean equal buying power.

My parents, on a single income, were able to build and pay off a 4000 sq ft home, in a very nice neighborhood in under 15 years. Put 4 kids through private school and save money for retirement.

They penny pinched certain things but they weren’t Scrooge’s.

My wife and I do not own a huge home nor do we live lavishly. We penny pinch and save and have a dual income household. We are nowhere near where my parents were.

But we are comfortable, which I believe is part of the problem. People who are comfortable are sometimes blind to what’s actually happening to them. And nobody wants to leave comfort for the unknown.
 
We may be more comfortable today but that doesn’t mean equal buying power.

My parents, on a single income, were able to build and pay off a 4000 sq ft home, in a very nice neighborhood in under 15 years. Put 4 kids through private school and save money for retirement.

They penny pinched certain things but they weren’t Scrooge’s.

My wife and I do not own a huge home nor do we live lavishly. We penny pinch and save and have a dual income household. We are nowhere near where my parents were.

But we are comfortable, which I believe is part of the problem. People who are comfortable are sometimes blind to what’s actually happening to them. And nobody wants to leave comfort for the unknown.

Not to get to far into the weeds but is the income your father made in 1973 when adjusted for inflation higher or lower than your income now?

Putting differences in economic theory aside there are so many nuisances that need to be accounted for when we compare the living standard of one generation to another. It is not just wages.
 
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This thread is going nowhere if we keep trying to compare an average wage in 73 to an actual wage today. If DamnSr was upper middle class making $40k in 73 then he was doing twice as well as you and the Mrs. are today at say $125k.

FWIW, in 73 we were a family of 7 living on about $20k. We didn’t eat a lot of meat in those days.
 
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This thread is going nowhere if we keep trying to compare an average wage in 73 to an actual wage today. If DamnSr was upper middle class making $40k in 73 then he was doing twice as well as you and the Mrs. are today at say $125k.

FWIW, in 73 we were a family of 7 living on about $20k. We didn’t eat a lot of meat in those days.

Correct. This was never a wage debate. It is an inflation and interest issue. Wages are simply a secondary issue caused by the first.

My actual goal for this thread? Meh. Don’t have one.

What I hope will happen?

That someone will raise AJ from the dead and install he and his hickory stick back in Washington.
 
Correct. This was never a wage debate. It is an inflation and interest issue. Wages are simply a secondary issue caused by the first.

My actual goal for this thread? Meh. Don’t have one.

What I hope will happen?

That someone will raise AJ from the dead and install he and his hickory stick back in Washington.

Interest is at an all time low pretty much across the board and have been for years. Inflation has been at about .06% for the last 12 months. Before COVID I think it was around 2.5%. If you have good credit right now people are offering you free money. The hidden thorn in the inflation numbers is the rising cost of food. It is well over 5% IIRC.

I guess you really didn't want a discussion you just wanted people to hit the like button and agree with you. I personally love the discussion. Being able to dissect the issue and look at it from multiple viewpoints seems like an worth while endeavor but I guess this was meant to be more a drive by. Have a good weekend.
 
Interest is at an all time low pretty much across the board and have been for years. Inflation has been at about .06% for the last 12 months. Before COVID I think it was around 2.5%. If you have good credit right now people are offering you free money. The hidden thorn in the inflation numbers is the rising cost of food. It is well over 5% IIRC.

I guess you really didn't want a discussion you just wanted people to hit the like button and agree with you. I personally love the discussion. Being able to dissect the issue and look at it from multiple viewpoints seems like an worth while endeavor but I guess this was meant to be more a drive by. Have a good weekend.

Nah. I just don’t have the time to actually debate every single thing you bring up. Like how artificial the jobless rate is since it excludes people who no longer look for a job or never did.

Or how keeping interest artificially low increases borrowing which in turn increases debt which increases interest for everyone down the road.

But you do you. I’m ok with not agreeing.
 
The hard core truth is putting your children through public school just reapeats the process.

I dont want to start a fight but sometimes its best to get an understanding for the big picture and go take a look in the mirror.

Dont take this as an attack. I just throw this out as something to think about. Perspective and priorities are important. How honest are people with themselves...really? Self deception is poison for the soul.

It took a little bit of work to get my wife to understand this when we had children. Its a bitter pill for most to just give up half of your household income to break the cycle. Lifestyles must be changed. Creature comfort wants need to be cut back. Priorities need to be prioritized. Its a lot easier to understand and make these decisions as early as possible but its never to late to turn it all around. It is easier for true believers that follow christianity...(why so many homeschoolers are christian based in their ideology) but anyone can do it.
 
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Nah. I just don’t have the time to actually debate every single thing you bring up. Like how artificial the jobless rate is since it excludes people who no longer look for a job or never did.

Or how keeping interest artificially low increases borrowing which in turn increases debt which increases interest for everyone down the road.

But you do you. I’m ok with not agreeing.

I agree that rates are artificially low. I also agree that unemployment is lower than reported. Those don’t fundamentally change your predicament.

Debt used properly is not evil IMHO. The problem isn’t debt it’s the people and the approach to debt that people causes issues. I think people consistently miss this distinction.
 
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I agree that rates are artificially low. I also agree that unemployment is lower than reported. Those don’t fundamentally change your predicament.

Debt used properly is not evil IMHO. The problem isn’t debt it’s the people and the approach to debt that people causes issues. I think people consistently miss this distinction.

On that we absolutely agree.
 
FYI - drone bees produce nothing, they are simply mating stock.

As far as the rest of the analogy, I believe there will always be a top bee, a king bee, or a bee with the money to pull the strings. Kill those bees and other bees take their places. It's just nature.

Now, as far as the parasite bees that produce nothing, only to be given the spoils by the king in trade for support? Those are chaff bees, and the sooner the leave the hive, the healthier the hive.
 
FYI - drone bees produce nothing, they are simply mating stock.

As far as the rest of the analogy, I believe there will always be a top bee, a king bee, or a bee with the money to pull the strings. Kill those bees and other bees take their places. It's just nature.

Now, as far as the parasite bees that produce nothing, only to be given the spoils by the king in trade for support? Those are chaff bees, and the sooner the leave the hive, the healthier the hive.

The Bees are all being killed by Asian Hornets.
 
About the furthest thing from an economist, but I was under the impression that our purchasing power, today, is about identical to 1974. Not higher or lower, but essentially identical.
https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-ta...rs-real-wages-have-barely-budged-for-decades/

And we have much better tech. Better air conditioning, better entertainment(tv/movies/internet). More reliable cars. GPS, smartphones, PCs, internet.

That's before my time, but if I could choose to live in '73 or live now, I'd choose now. Yeah, in 1880 Britain, most people could afford a maid. But you also lived in a smog ridden city and had no flushing toilets.

Do we need to increase our purchasing power, lower prices? Yeah, I'd like that. But I don't think it's as doom and gloom as being portrayed and, since we are in the process of divesting from China, I expect to see prices bump up for 2-3 years before alternative production facilities are made.

Yeah, I'd like to make more, and have that money worth more. But I live frugally, keep debts low, and invest a ton(because Social Security will be bankrupt by the time I retire). Don't see what I can do to improve things, beyond improving my skills to make me more income mobile.

Wages no not equal purchasing power. In 1974 it was relatively easy to have a single income family. Not so much now.
 
Interest is at an all time low pretty much across the board and have been for years. Inflation has been at about .06% for the last 12 months. Before COVID I think it was around 2.5%. If you have good credit right now people are offering you free money. The hidden thorn in the inflation numbers is the rising cost of food. It is well over 5% IIRC.

I guess you really didn't want a discussion you just wanted people to hit the like button and agree with you. I personally love the discussion. Being able to dissect the issue and look at it from multiple viewpoints seems like an worth while endeavor but I guess this was meant to be more a drive by. Have a good weekend.

Shadowstats has a different take on inflation numbers. They way the Gov fudges job and inflation numbers nobody really knows where we are. Kinda like Covid case and death stats.
 
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