Triangle Shooting Academy update from Bill
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BigWaylon
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...and if your friend jumped off a bridge, would you jump?
It's simple not wise to mix your business and your politics. It only serves to turn people off and doesn't gain you anything. If you're going to do it, it would be best to use a separate user account. Those who learn your identity probably will agree with you and support you anyway.
I'll be there tomorrow with my sales staff.
T
The Green Heron
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That's the second time I've heard that quoted.
"Almost all gun owners are unsafe as hell."
Really? Unless they have "special training" huh?
My butt isn't hurt because you won't hand me a weapon I don't safely clear. Almost all is a hell of a lot of gun owners. I'd say those statistics are way off. If you are in the training business, I can understand how it seems like everyone is dangerous around guns.
I've been swept plenty by "trained" gun owners.
You know what I've found? The guys with a training badge are cocky enough that they pay little attention to gun safety, because they "have training".
Let's not start posting videos of all the dumb @$$es who are certified trainers, that do stupid $#!t.
People doing stupid $#!t happens on all ends of the spectrum. That includes business owners.
"Almost all gun owners are unsafe as hell."
Really? Unless they have "special training" huh?
My butt isn't hurt because you won't hand me a weapon I don't safely clear. Almost all is a hell of a lot of gun owners. I'd say those statistics are way off. If you are in the training business, I can understand how it seems like everyone is dangerous around guns.
I've been swept plenty by "trained" gun owners.
You know what I've found? The guys with a training badge are cocky enough that they pay little attention to gun safety, because they "have training".
Let's not start posting videos of all the dumb @$$es who are certified trainers, that do stupid $#!t.
People doing stupid $#!t happens on all ends of the spectrum. That includes business owners.
I'll add a few things in different post so it doesn't get lost in one sermon.
Mr. Boyette you make some good points but your approach is very bad. I've read some of your post beyond this one and they need a little work. Unfortunately most customer service associates and owners of LGS have much the same approach.
The internet sales have killed the gun stores and they will go by the way side much faster in the future generations. It's a given. Brick and mortar sales as a whole are crumbling. I fight that battle as well daily as an owner. Business owners become bitter and it shows interacting with customers. The reason Bill has not come back on here and responded is because it would not be wise. It will prolong the agony and pit him against the gun community. This is intelligent on his part.
Mr. Boyette you make some good points but your approach is very bad. I've read some of your post beyond this one and they need a little work. Unfortunately most customer service associates and owners of LGS have much the same approach.
The internet sales have killed the gun stores and they will go by the way side much faster in the future generations. It's a given. Brick and mortar sales as a whole are crumbling. I fight that battle as well daily as an owner. Business owners become bitter and it shows interacting with customers. The reason Bill has not come back on here and responded is because it would not be wise. It will prolong the agony and pit him against the gun community. This is intelligent on his part.
I take customers here because it's a nice facility that makes a really good impression on novice/non-shooters. Lots of displays to look at, comfortable, clean, professional looking etc. I'm perfectly happy going to a dumpy facility with lots of exposed concrete and tires on my own time, but when trying to entertain clients who aren't hard core shooters (or are non-shooters but willing to play along) a better facility goes a long way. The reasonably short safety brief available any time makes it super easy to get people to go. It's a fantastic resource.
That said, I hate the first version of this whole sign business. It sounds like that after the first sniff test by the public the policy was revised and makes more sense, ie keep loaded stuff secure unless the SHTF. Why wasn't that the first attempt? Why go full disarmament right out of the gate? Why act like bloomberg? No guns for you, but lots of guns for me. Don't worry, we'll protect you.
I'm sure I'll continue to give them business while on the expense account for the reasons mentioned in the first paragraph, but as John mentioned I'm not a personal customer and never went there anyway (due to other things I don't like about them) so I won't pretend to "vote with my feet" since I did that long ago.
That said, I hate the first version of this whole sign business. It sounds like that after the first sniff test by the public the policy was revised and makes more sense, ie keep loaded stuff secure unless the SHTF. Why wasn't that the first attempt? Why go full disarmament right out of the gate? Why act like bloomberg? No guns for you, but lots of guns for me. Don't worry, we'll protect you.
I'm sure I'll continue to give them business while on the expense account for the reasons mentioned in the first paragraph, but as John mentioned I'm not a personal customer and never went there anyway (due to other things I don't like about them) so I won't pretend to "vote with my feet" since I did that long ago.
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D
Dadawada
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I think responsible gun owners just want to go to a place where they are welcome and treated with respect. Between liberal media, increasing "No firearms allowed", and a overzealous public we (I) feel like an outcast, that I have to continue to hide my enjoyment of gun ownership. So yeah, when a place I should feel welcome at comes out with an announcement that makes me feel less welcome I probably overreact. My bad.
The media and the left have already successfully separated us as citizens. It appears they are also successful at separating us as gun owners.
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The media and the left have already successfully separated us as citizens. It appears they are also successful at separating us as gun owners.
Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
Hopefully he at least reads what people, his potential customer base are saying.
I never liked the fact that gun forums had a section for posting good or bad reviews about stores. Posting on a thread is ok with me but not opening an entire section for bickering. The internet feedback availability can simple destroy a business at warp speed. Word of mouth references are almost null and void. People don't call their friends much anymore for references, they look for the 0-5 star rating, and honestly they pick the bad reviews more to see the drama.
The digital age can work for you or against you. A person can have issue with your forum comments and simple go to Yelp and blast your business. Tact is critical in the digital business community.
The digital age can work for you or against you. A person can have issue with your forum comments and simple go to Yelp and blast your business. Tact is critical in the digital business community.
Once again the thread has veered off in many pissey directions. Bottom line is Bill the owner of TSA came on this site and posted purely for damage control as I see it. Then made up a lame excuse about an error in communication and he writes here he is not really banning conceal carry at his business. I think he did this only because he thought the fallout might hurt business. If you think that's wrong, oh well. Again its his business to run the way he wants. But the way he handled this is from the same play book the left uses to cover their tracks when they are caught in a lie. I don't use his establishment and how he run his place is up to him, I wish him the best. But if he comes here with his excesses......
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He's watching and reacting. Everyone has his attention. Posting the door and a huge banner that states guns cannot be taken out of a holster or case inside except while on a station would be a huge improvement. If checking for holster fit then make it where the staff removes the magazine and chambered round in an empty room/range. It would be asinine to pull a gun out of a holster in a restaurant or grocery store and it's asinine to do it in a gun shop.
D
Dadawada
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Unfortunately sometimes the same thing a liberal anti-gun establishment does...you say no carrying or concealed allowed.
Or maybe some of us think 2A rights are more important than gun shop owner solidarity. If that person uses their "authority" as a trainer to try and f!ck us out of rights in an internet publication, is that okay? Because I know where that puts them in my book. I've been to and support plenty of B&M stores, but once they get on a "I support 2a, but" wagon, that's it for me. If expressing that properly sets a grown @ss man into a tizzy, so be it.
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NCLivingBrit
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I'm sorry, was I supposed to start nodding and agree to change my ways because you disagree with my opinions?
Dude, get over yourself.
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Dadawada
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And sorry, not meaning to pick on you but this sounds like something a liberal gun control advocate would say...just sayin. And it's "mitigate".
The way to "lower exposure" is not go to indoor ranges where there are hordes of new gun owners and staff who do stupid things with loaded fire arms.
The way I see it if you clean a vacum cleaner you are a vacum cleaner. Think about it.
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Dadawada
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So your saying the first mate on a fishing boat that is a master at baiting hooks is a master baiter?
Lol,, Barret,, that's some funny shit
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A lot of good points are being made from various aspects of this thread, and I think it's very important to air our differences in the context of the protections afforded by the Second Amendment to the Rights we have as Free Men and Free Women.
Understanding the business aspect, sometimes there are things done in the name of safety and/or economics that do cut across the spirit of which the Second Amendment stands. @JBoyette makes a very good point: no matter how safe you are, it's highly likely that we all have done something from time to time that's unsafe. It's simply a fact of being human.
That said, coming out and shitting on people for standing firmly on the Second Amendment when it's part and parcel with your business is in the least bad form and in the worst a terrible miscalculation of the willingness of our community to stand on principle. Whether new shooters are required to thrive in the Firearms business or not is irrelevant if those who are your base of income simply decide to shop elsewhere.
One thing is certain: our Rights end where another's begin. So as the property owner, TSA has the unalienable Right to decide which Arms are allowed and the manner in which they are allowed, and in so doing do not violate our Rights to Keep and Bear Arms.
That said, gun owners also have the same unalienable Right to Property, in that we may choose to whom and for what we trade our Property (in the form of money).
The thing about this crowd that our opponents clearly understand is that we are passionate about gun Rights. It surprised me that after 8 years of Obama that perhaps some in our own folks haven't learned that 30 seconds of Fudding can destroy 30+ years of pro-2A pretty much permanently. That's why policies like this, if they're to be enacted, should be well thought out, the thought process extremely transparent, and the membership somewhat involved in the rules of the club they support with their dues.
Retractions can be avoided easily within our community so long as you remember not to shit where you eat.
Understanding the business aspect, sometimes there are things done in the name of safety and/or economics that do cut across the spirit of which the Second Amendment stands. @JBoyette makes a very good point: no matter how safe you are, it's highly likely that we all have done something from time to time that's unsafe. It's simply a fact of being human.
That said, coming out and shitting on people for standing firmly on the Second Amendment when it's part and parcel with your business is in the least bad form and in the worst a terrible miscalculation of the willingness of our community to stand on principle. Whether new shooters are required to thrive in the Firearms business or not is irrelevant if those who are your base of income simply decide to shop elsewhere.
One thing is certain: our Rights end where another's begin. So as the property owner, TSA has the unalienable Right to decide which Arms are allowed and the manner in which they are allowed, and in so doing do not violate our Rights to Keep and Bear Arms.
That said, gun owners also have the same unalienable Right to Property, in that we may choose to whom and for what we trade our Property (in the form of money).
The thing about this crowd that our opponents clearly understand is that we are passionate about gun Rights. It surprised me that after 8 years of Obama that perhaps some in our own folks haven't learned that 30 seconds of Fudding can destroy 30+ years of pro-2A pretty much permanently. That's why policies like this, if they're to be enacted, should be well thought out, the thought process extremely transparent, and the membership somewhat involved in the rules of the club they support with their dues.
Retractions can be avoided easily within our community so long as you remember not to shit where you eat.
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T
trcubed
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I'm not handing my loaded firearm to anyone else for them to clear it, and they are most definitely not taking it out of my sight.
If you go in a shop looking for a holster, the most simple and safest way to check the fit is to take it to the gun counter and ask them to try it with one of their guns. Any LGS with a decent stock will most likely have a gun identical to the one you're carrying.
Leave yours concealed. Seems to me that drawing a loaded weapon in a room full of armed...and evidently nervous and distrustful...salespeople is a good way to get shot.
ETA: forgot a very important word...bolded in the first paragraph.
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The difference is that whether it is John or TSA that asks you to make safe or leave a gun behind, they are providing other active security, while the gun control advocate wants you to be defenseless just like him.
On this topic, I am To far away to shoo here but use to live closer and I went into TSA, and asked if they had left handed holsters and the sales guy told me that they didn't sell enough of them and I would need to look online or purchase a right handed one. I got a bit upset because of his rudeness but, i didn't take it personally on all of TSA because of one "poor to me" expieroencd. I have been back one other time looking for something specific and the counter guys walked by me 4 or 5 times and never asked if I needed anything when I was standing there obviously patiently waiting my turn for them to help me. I did not buy from them because no one would help me despite me saying excuse me to theee of the 4 that had passed me. I will go back but only if only if I have time to kill, and I am just piddling. I have never used their range and don't really plan to as I have other options to use. I don't want to see Bill fail at all and the store is his and he can make the rules just like we can chose to shop there or not. Now customer service is a big reason that I chose to or not to shop at places. I don't want to be coddled or molested by salesmen but when I ask questions about items I want honest answers or "I don't know the answer" I don't want someone telling me I need such and such to obtain "operator status" however I do want them help me I do have questions or want to look at something. TSA has never been any worse than any other gun shop with regard to the customer service I routinely get at any other types of businesses and as such I would go back and look from time to time when I lived closer. That being said my go to gun shop is ALWAYS friendly and attentative even thou I pay a bit more there some times but it is where I feel comfortable and happy spending my money. TSA is that place for many others and that's fine and dandy and great for them and the 2A community as well.
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Ok I don't know the cost of blue guns, but perhaps like was previously stated, if you want to try a holster is it possible to have blue guns to use?? I know there is an expense to them and there are so many models out there that it could be a mess but just a thought.
Lol, I know, right?! I think you get this, but my point is I don't understand why folks get so indignant about a private business restricting carry when we have these glaring, huge infringements of gun free zones in schools, public buildings and the military, where often no security is provided....and if your friend jumped off a bridge, would you jump?
I think TSAs ownership/mgt has handled this poorly, and I was not aware if he spoke against constitutional carry in NC. I will look into that, and that would be a deal breaker for me because as I understand it, constitutional carry wouldn't restrict his private property rights, and a voice like his would give politicians all the cover they need to vote against it.
You can let whomever provide you with your security. But myself and myself alone will provide MY security. 99% of the time if that option is taken away from me, then that a place I don't need to be anyway.
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It's because for some of us, .....shall not be infringed means exactly that, as every small infringement that was tolerated in the past has brought a thousand more.
And the sum of those thousand small infringements is a huge impact upon our Rights.
Remember, it is always against the negligent or the criminal that unjust regulations and laws are first aimed, while those same regulations and laws violate the Rights and Liberty of the vast majority of People who've done no harm.
That is where tyranny is born....and if it isn't stamped out there, you soon end up with the big infringements you lament.
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BurnedOutGeek
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This whole trying the fit of a holster thing boggles me. If it's a custom holster I could see it, but ones that are stamped out by the hundreds for what is most likely the most popular 20-30% of guns available? I'm sure the ones they carry "in stock" are gonna fit. Just buy the dang holster and play with it when you get home. Seems simple enough.
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And just how many holsters do they sell that this has become this big of a problem?
BurnedOutGeek
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trcubed
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Agreed. The commercial manufacturers have probably figured out how to make a Glock 19 holster by now. The only time I've ever wanted to test a holster was when I bought my STI. Still...I did like you mention above, bought the holster and tried it at home.
I hear you and that is what I am aiming for, but the practical reality is that life generally requires us to make compromises, whether it is at an ER or airport, or some aspects of regular day to day goings on.
Hence if I can't drive there. I have no need to be there. If I'm bad enough to need to go to the ER I'm unconscious and that fits in to the 1%. Regular day to day stuff, if one place doesn't want my money then another place will.
Maybe I don't understand the situation right, but with regard to TSA we are talking about a property owner's right to control behavior on their property, right?
The 2A restricts government from infringing on our natural right to bear arms, but doesn't restrict or take away the property owners rights.
People are seeming to complain/act out more about the property owners behavior instead of actual infringements, even in light of the likely fact that this property owner/business is netting more societal support for removeing/preventing govt infringements.
I think that TSA would be wise to improve their carry policy, id reqts for purchases and employee behavior with ideas from this thread, and also support constitutional carry. It seems like that combo could grow their mass market opportunity while also getting support from more experienced and liberty minded folks who clearly are/could be great recruiters to their classes, shop and range.
I am sincerely glad you have those options and it all works for you. I have been in the ER at least six times in the past two years for family and friends.
To bring it back on topic, TSAs policy is less onerous to me (and their clientele is way better than the ERs!) To each their own.
Soccer moms/dads and hipsters vote and organize other voters to their mindset.
When they do those things, I would prefer they value their own right to be armed as much as I do mine.