Silver

I actually heard Dave Ramsey say lead ( meaning ammo) was a better investment than gold or silver in a financial collapse!
Besides ammo I’ve been thinking seriously about buying Vodka and storing it for a form of financial revenue/ tradeable goods. 🤔
Airplane "mini bottles" if they can be obtained inexpensively might be a better option than larger bottles because they are easier to transport and store and easily traded. :)

People refer to gold and silver as "precious metals" and they are but given the scarce availability AND prices of ammo, one could argue that lead should be included in that group as well!
 
I actually heard Dave Ramsey say lead ( meaning ammo) was a better investment than gold or silver in a financial collapse!
Besides ammo I’ve been thinking seriously about buying Vodka and storing it for a form of financial revenue/ tradeable goods. 🤔
We were just talking about this at work. Now what's better? Vodka or whiskey?
 
We were just talking about this at work. Now what's better? Vodka or whiskey?
I would say Vodka because it can be also used for an antiseptic , not that whiskey wouldn’t work! LOL!
But you can flavor vodka to almost anyone’s liking. Also for the record I’ve said before, I live about 15 minutes from JR cigars if I need to go rouge and add tobacco to my stock!
 
I would say Vodka because it can be also used for an antiseptic , not that whiskey wouldn’t work! LOL!
But you can flavor vodka to almost anyone’s liking. Also for the record I’ve said before, I live about 15 minutes from JR cigars if I need to go rouge and add tobacco to my stock!
I live very close to jr as well
 
We were just talking about this at work. Now what's better? Vodka or whiskey?
Come on fellas! There are known cases of people drinking *poisonous* rubbing alcohol or even Sterno...if alcohol is THAT important to someone to get their "fix" with, they're not gonna care if it's vodka or whiskey. 😃

In all seriousness, though, I don't think it would matter. Plus with mini bottles, you can buy a lot of a lot of different alcohols. By the way, won't tobacco go bad if it's not temperature/humidity controlled? Not sure if tobacco's a good idea in the long run.
 
Come on fellas! There are known cases of people drinking *poisonous* rubbing alcohol or even Sterno...if alcohol is THAT important to someone to get their "fix" with, they're not gonna care if it's vodka or whiskey. 😃

In all seriousness, though, I don't think it would matter. Plus with mini bottles, you can buy a lot of a lot of different alcohols. By the way, won't tobacco go bad if it's not temperature/humidity controlled? Not sure if tobacco's a good idea in the long run.
I was thinking same thing about tobacco. Good point on the minis
 
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Again, the idea that there is only utter societal collapse into lawlessness vs "pretty much the same" is a false choice. I have said before that I do NOT look for a "Patriots" style collapse. Everything would have to line up right for that. Rather, I think we should look to the events in Ukraine (yeah, THAT Ukraine) back in 1992 or so, some of the events around Bosnia, the stuff of Ferfal from Buenos Aires in .... I think it was 2002. These were severe economic contractions, which led to social unrest and some very dangerous stuff, and a relocation of wealth, among other things.
Even if there is a "grid down"kind of thing that lasts for some time, people will COME OUT OF THEIR HIDEY HOLES and look to do what people always do, which is offer goods and services for exchangable items used as currency. "Lead" sounds romantic if you have visions of yourself in a stone walled turret somewhere screaming out "WOLVERINES" and all, but you are way more likely to be dead long before that....., and yes, I have a BUNCH of .22 ammo for trade in the event of precisely that situation. I also have some corn liquor, cans of food, soap, and other items for barter. I just don't really expect to have to use it.

Silver is money, and I want money in an economic collapse. Especially when other people don't have it.
 
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You have it right, the premium differs based on the level of trust or credibility. You wouldn’t pay the same for a random lump of silvery colored metal as you would for a silver coin that was minted, what you’re describing is just finer details of that.

As for selling in the sticks, that implies a SHTF scenario where someone in rural america will accept silver for something of his that you want, I think that scenario is unlikely.


Lots of people in the sticks accept silver as a means of exchange right now. I think you are more likely to find a silver bug in the country than the city. At least percentage wise. When I sold my silver stash for a house buy I sold to way more country bumpkins than anyone else.
 
Lots of people in the sticks accept silver as a means of exchange right now. I think you are more likely to find a silver bug in the country than the city. At least percentage wise. When I sold my silver stash for a house buy I sold to way more country bumpkins than anyone else.
Can’t argue with your experience, but I don’t think it’s applicable to a future period when nobody will have excess disposable income. Farm folk are practical, and in a deep depression I expect that when a farmer has a basket of corn to sell it’ll go to the guy that offers 10gal of diesel and not the guy that offers 10oz of silver.
 
Can’t argue with your experience, but I don’t think it’s applicable to a future period when nobody will have excess disposable income. Farm folk are practical, and in a deep depression I expect that when a farmer has a basket of corn to sell it’ll go to the guy that offers 10gal of diesel and not the guy that offers 10oz of silver.
You are missing the point of “money” I think. Barter only goes so far.
 
Can’t argue with your experience, but I don’t think it’s applicable to a future period when nobody will have excess disposable income. Farm folk are practical, and in a deep depression I expect that when a farmer has a basket of corn to sell it’ll go to the guy that offers 10gal of diesel and not the guy that offers 10oz of silver.


I’m thinking more of times between what we have now and Mad Max.
 
I’m thinking more of times between what we have now and Mad Max.
My example wasn’t good. I think in terms of the year or two after either a war we lose or a failure of the US dollar. In those situations there will still be a robust global market for silver and there will be a new currency. If you have lots of silver you’ll convert to whatever the new currency is as needed. Most folks savings and even income would have been decimated, not Mad Max, but it’s a lot closer to subsistence living, and I think converting it to currency or goods in the rural areas will be more difficult.

Obviously we have no idea what the circumstances will be, I think we each have our own notions and fears that we try to plan for, and we’ll all be wrong to some degree.
 
My example wasn’t good. I think in terms of the year or two after either a war we lose or a failure of the US dollar. In those situations there will still be a robust global market for silver and there will be a new currency. If you have lots of silver you’ll convert to whatever the new currency is as needed. Most folks savings and even income would have been decimated, not Mad Max, but it’s a lot closer to subsistence living, and I think converting it to currency or goods in the rural areas will be more difficult.

Obviously we have no idea what the circumstances will be, I think we each have our own notions and fears that we try to plan for, and we’ll all be wrong to some degree.


Agreed. PMs are just one component of a well rounded basket of preparedness.
 
Can’t argue with your experience, but I don’t think it’s applicable to a future period when nobody will have excess disposable income. Farm folk are practical, and in a deep depression I expect that when a farmer has a basket of corn to sell it’ll go to the guy that offers 10gal of diesel and not the guy that offers 10oz of silver.
Country bumpkin here…No one knows what’s coming. I mean the propped up stock market shoulda crashed literally years ago and silver should be at $275 an ounce with the supply/demand alone in our “Green solar/wind/EV” world we live in. If you have ANY cash in your pocket, safe, or bank then you believe in currency. Silver will always be a currency as it is real money. It ain’t just shiny and for jewelry like gold. It’s useful beyond description. So if you want my bushel of corn for 20 ounces of silver you come get it anytime!!
 
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Country bumpkin here…No one knows what’s coming. I mean the propped up stock market shoulda crashed literally years ago and silver should be at $275 an ounce with the supply/demand alone in our “Green solar/wind/EV” world we live in. If you have ANY cash in your pocket, safe, or bank then you believe in currency. Silver will always be a currency as it is real money. It ain’t just shiny and for jewelry like gold. It’s useful beyond description. So if you want my bushel of corn for 20 ounces of silver you come get it anytime!!
My offer of 10oz was more than generous even with corn contracts trading above $600, no need to try to sneak that extra 10oz in there!
 
Agreed. PMs are just one component of a well rounded basket of preparedness.
This X1000. I consider myself a prepper. To some, minor level. To others, bat sh*t crazy level. I've gotten a very healthy stash of survival things. I've spent several years now building it up. I've tried to think out every scenario. Some you just can't prep for, like that giant army base being nuked 20 miles from my house. I'm now very low on space for more food. I'll add some medical preps and a little more ammo every paycheck, but I'm now doing very well on all those areas. Now it's time to start thinking about a USSR style collapse vs a Bosnia style collapse. Silver is that area for me. The dollar simply can't sustain itself in fiat form. A shift has to happen at some point.
 
This X1000. I consider myself a prepper. To some, minor level. To others, bat sh*t crazy level. I've gotten a very healthy stash of survival things. I've spent several years now building it up. I've tried to think out every scenario. Some you just can't prep for, like that giant army base being nuked 20 miles from my house. I'm now very low on space for more food. I'll add some medical preps and a little more ammo every paycheck, but I'm now doing very well on all those areas. Now it's time to start thinking about a USSR style collapse vs a Bosnia style collapse. Silver is that area for me. The dollar simply can't sustain itself in fiat form. A shift has to happen at some point.
Do you have a preferred type of silver? Everyone says the eagles. I'm just curious. In that type of situation, wouldn't any silver that can be verified as real be worthy?

I've said before I'm new to this so just trying to learn from guys who have been doing it for a while now. Thanks in advance.
 
Do you have a preferred type of silver? Everyone says the eagles. I'm just curious. In that type of situation, wouldn't any silver that can be verified as real be worthy?

I've said before I'm new to this so just trying to learn from guys who have been doing it for a while now. Thanks in advance.
I too am new to this. Personally, I say diversify. It seems apmex is the most trusted. You'll pay a hefty premium for the eagles. I intend to have a good lot of junk (90% silver US coins, mostly pre '64) and 999 coins like apmex. You'll pay less premium for things like 10oz bars, but that's not as easily divided if the time comes to actually spend and buy things with it. So again, my plan is to have a nice diversity of coins and types. Who knows if we'll get decades to buy and build up a stock, or if the economy will fall off a cliff tomorrow. Buy what you can, when you can.
 
I was thinking same thing about tobacco. Good point on the minis
Tobacco could pose a storage problem, it all depends on humidity. Seen a guy on YouTube saving seeds and growing his on. Cigar tobacco differs from the bright leaf we know here. Back to the silver still pondering, at the very least going to at least find as many old coins I can! The question I pose what’s the least amount of silver to have regardless of income?
 
If any of you use an Apple iPhone, there's a great app called, "PCGS Coinflation" on Apple's App Store. If memory serves, it's a free app. Anyway, what's cool about it is that you can tell the app what kinds of silver coins you have and the quantities you have (i.e. "2 1964 Kennedy ½ dollars") and it'll calculate the melt value based on current silver prices. You can also look up gold & silver scrap based on purity levels (i.e. .925 or .999 or karats) and it'll calculate live melt values.


I'm not an Android person so there might be an Android version of this out there too.

I hope this helps!
 
If any of you use an Apple iPhone, there's a great app called, "PCGS Coinflation" on Apple's App Store. If memory serves, it's a free app. Anyway, what's cool about it is that you can tell the app what kinds of silver coins you have and the quantities you have (i.e. "2 1964 Kennedy ½ dollars") and it'll calculate the melt value based on current silver prices. You can also look up gold & silver scrap based on purity levels (i.e. .925 or .999 or karats) and it'll calculate live melt values.


I'm not an Android person so there might be an Android version of this out there too.

I hope this helps!
A paranoid type could see this as an attempt to get people to tell the developer who/where has precious metals…
 
A paranoid type could see this as an attempt to get people to tell the developer who/where has precious metals…
Of that, we can be sure (i.e. paranoid types)! On the other hand, those people shouldn't be on a forum called, "Carolina Firearms Forum" because that would suggest they have an affinity for and/or have firearms themselves . . . on no, the horror! 😱
 
I too am new to this. Personally, I say diversify. It seems apmex is the most trusted. You'll pay a hefty premium for the eagles. I intend to have a good lot of junk (90% silver US coins, mostly pre '64) and 999 coins like apmex. You'll pay less premium for things like 10oz bars, but that's not as easily divided if the time comes to actually spend and buy things with it. So again, my plan is to have a nice diversity of coins and types. Who knows if we'll get decades to buy and build up a stock, or if the economy will fall off a cliff tomorrow. Buy what you can, when you can.
I’ve been doing silver for decades and Eagles used to be the way to go when they had 10% premiums not at 30-50 % premiums that’s a lot of wasted money you coulda spent in more weight. I suggest in todays market 1 ounce rounds stamped APMEX through Walmart.com if you want the most bang for your buck and reputable enough anyone will trade it. Prices go up from there but diversify like others have said so get weight first then when your ounces are up but some maples or eagles or bars etc etc. I am a prepper so weight is first and foremost for me.
 
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stock market shoulda crashed literally years ago ...;...
Wow. I loaded up short and did a HUGE gain in 2022, only to see the slobbering fools rush in screaming "BUY BUY BUY!!! we MIGHT see a pivot on interest rates!!!!" then "we MIGHT have seen the last of the 1/2 per cent rises" and then a frenzied squealing panic to buy every time the fed says ANYTHING other than "we are going to cause astonishing pain and raise rates to the point where the economy shuts down." In fact even when there is an announcement that we are going to have severe pain... if the slightest hint is given that the rate rises MIGHT be having an effecct.... the market completely ignores the bad stuff, focuses on what it WANTS to hear, and the market goes blasting into the ionosphere. In fact, the DOW if functionally where it was when I initially plunged short back in April. It is utter imbecility and a bunch of market makers sitting on about a thousand S&P points (maybe 5,000 to 6,000 Dow points) of nothing but pure air and hopium.

I am no longer in serious positional trades. I sit and wait for the market to enter into the normal spasms like last week when one of the (non voting) fed members said he thought we would not go 1/2 a percent rise next month, and damn if that wasn't enough to send the market into a paroxysm of panic buying that pushed the market up 600 or so points. You just try to scalp that and catch part of the ride and then GET OUT, so you can wait for today and have Powell say what he has said all along, and forecast hi rates for a long time, and the market sinks what is right now 534 points. Just hyperstupid volatility based on hyperstupid hope that we can avoid wha is staring us in the face (yes, I am short today).

Are we headed for at least 3200 on the S&P and probably lower, maybe MUCH lower? Crap yes. A blind man can see it while wearing dark glasses in a blackout room. But the fed is acting as a "plunge protection" team and the big banks are performing as instructed and radical shorts are getting burned. The market is acting irrational, but back even BEFORE the US Treasury got involved as a market manipulator, it was true that "the market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent."
I have given up on the idea of plunging short and cleaning up when the bottom falls out. I don't think they will let the bottom fall out (although there may be days of nail biting horror... for which I am staying mildly short). That is fine. I don't have to plunge. I can scalp.

It is a crooked game, gentlemen.

gollum2.jpg
 
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from above:

"....scarce availability AND prices of ammo, one could argue that lead should be included in that group as well!"

tungsten, too?
 
Wow. I loaded up short and did a HUGE gain in 2022, only to see the slobbering fools rush in screaming "BUY BUY BUY!!! we MIGHT see a pivot on interest rates!!!!" then "we MIGHT have seen the last of the 1/2 per cent rises" and then a frenzied squealing panic to buy every time the fed says ANYTHING other than "we are going to cause astonishing pain and raise rates to the point where the economy shuts down." In fact even when there is an announcement that we are going to have severe pain... if the slightest hint is given that the rate rises MIGHT be having an effecct.... the market completely ignores the bad stuff, focuses on what it WANTS to hear, and the market goes blasting into the ionosphere. In fact, the DOW if functionally where it was when I initially plunged short back in April. It is utter imbecility and a bunch of market makers sitting on about a thousand S&P points (maybe 5,000 to 6,000 Dow points) of nothing but pure air and hopium.

I am no longer in serious positional trades. I sit and wait for the market to enter into the normal spasms like last week when one of the (non voting) fed members said he thought we would not go 1/2 a percent rise next month, and damn if that wasn't enough to send the market into a paroxysm of panic buying that pushed the market up 600 or so points. You just try to scalp that and catch part of the ride and then GET OUT, so you can wait for today and have Powell say what he has said all along, and forecast hi rates for a long time, and the market sinks what is right now 534 points. Just hyperstupid volatility based on hyperstupid hope that we can avoid wha is staring us in the face (yes, I am short today).

Are we headed for at least 3200 on the S&P and probably lower, maybe MUCH lower? Crap yes. A blind man can see it while wearing dark glasses in a blackout room. But the fed is acting as a "plunge protection" team and the big banks are performing as instructed and radical shorts are getting burned. The market is acting irrational, but back even BEFORE the US Treasury got involved as a market manipulator, it was true that "the market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent."
I have given up on the idea of plunging short and cleaning up when the bottom falls out. I don't think they will let the bottom fall out (although there may be days of nail biting horror... for which I am staying mildly short). That is fine. I don't have to plunge. I can scalp.

It is a crooked game, gentlemen.

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Buddy sent me a note earlier, said “good day to buy” to which I responded “better than yesterday, but we’ve still got at least 10% weight to lose before it’s good. The dow was below 30k less than 6 months ago, and that wasn’t exactly based on fundamentals.

Put some spare cash into T-bills this week, too busy to work this stuff.
 
Would you take Buffalo rounds or APMEX rounds? Priced the same via Walmart. Agree APMEX direct looks good on the surface but for 20ish rounds if you’re using a CC it’s a better deal via Walmart. Picking up my first load this week. Down 10% since last week.
 
They are both good. I say APMEX as people that aren’t into silver can google and feel comfy with APMEX. Buffalos are great and I have many of them but many many mints make their own flavor of buffalos and it’s based on old currency but isn’t currency etc etc so much easier for people’s eyes to glaze over and back away IMO.
 
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Not sure if the question has been posed but any thoughts on a minimum amount? I know financial ability makes a difference. So maybe I should ask minimum budget on investments in silver?
 
I just started with silver and was wondering this myself. I kinda feel like the answer is- as much as you can get while still covering all other bases.
 
Not sure if the question has been posed but any thoughts on a minimum amount? I know financial ability makes a difference. So maybe I should ask minimum budget on investments in silver?
You need to fund your life, and then decide what to do with what’s left. PMs have mostly been a crappy investment, they have their ups and downs, but mostly they hedge inflation, equities outperform them by a wide margin. So you need to decide if you want your money to make money or you want to preserve capital. The answer to that will tell you how much you can spend. Or you can listen to the silver bugs, buy all you can and hope that you’ve timed the market right.

The other issue with physical silver is that it’s as bad as ammo for fixing you in one spot. An amount sufficient to get you comfortably through a collapse of the dollar probably weighs more than you can carry for any distance. Not saying don’t buy it, just understand the limitation.
 
PMs have mostly been a crappy investment
PMs are NOT "investments"
They don't pay dividends They don't create wealth. THEY DO NOT INCREASE IN VALUE (trust me on this one). They do nothing except SIT THERE AND PRESERVE WEALTH.... and that is why you should have some.
They are insurance and wealth preservers. Nothing more.
First rule of "investing"... know what you are buying and why.
HOWEVER, in an age where central banks have set the stage for the most radical devaluation of paper currency since Weimar, speculating with PMs is a more strategic decision for wealth preservation (and even wealth transfer) than you are going to get for the rest of your life.
 
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