Army Drops Requirement for High School Diploma Amid Recruiting Crisis
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Chuckman
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Yes, very bizarre. It was explain to me that it assessed your ability to learn a language through pattern recognition. I didn't understand a damn thing lol.
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It's basically a made up language (I've heard based on Korean) and in order to get a passing score you have to be able to recognize the rules of the language like sentence structure, verb conjugation, etc. I took it the first time in basic, but have no idea how I scored. I figure the Army wasn't going to send me to language school since I enlisted as a DAT (dumb *ss tanker), so why bother telling me. 😉
The second time I took it was when I was joining a Reserve MI unit, and apparently I scored well enough to qualify for any language offered at the Defense Language Institute. Unfortunately, my Reserve unit changed missions after I enlisted but before I went to school, so instead of going to DLI for Russian as originally planned, I went for Latin American Spanish. I can say that DLI in Monterey, CA, was an incredible place to be stationed.
Chuckman
Senior Member
I took it, I got 1+/1+ in Russian, because I had 3 years of Russian in college. How has offered all sorts of money to go into intelligence. In hindsight, that field is always wide open in the Navy for promotion and I ended up going medical, the most heavily overmanned rating that barely moves with promotions lol.
Never been to DLI, but I've seen some videos. That place is beautiful.
I would like to see numbers from this year on re-enlistment. Everyone I know who came up got out of the Army. One in the Air Force stayed, one in the marines stayed. Two of the Army guys were in their second contract and hated their second time. Two others in my son’s graduating class didn’t make 2 years in the Navy due to drug testing. Not looking good.
Russki is a hard one - six tenses ain't no joke.
If I was still in at this point I’d have just shy of 19 years so the only thing retaining me would be the last little bit to get me over the 20 year hump and I’d be looking for the door
I took the ASVAB twice; one with all the other males in the HS cafeteria my junior year, and again when I actually got serious about joining a couple years later. The 2nd time was at Ft Jackson MEPS and I took it at a computer with a proctor. The terminals were spaced out so there was absolutely no way you could cheat or be fed answers by a recruiter…no one was allowed in besides enlistee and proctor
A friend of mine went to DLI for Arabic or Farsi, can’t remember which, part of the special operations MOS he had. I DO remember him having the DoD windshield sticker with “Presidio of Monterey” under it and feeling a pang of envy lol.
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Cat 4s and 5s = rocks...some made really good joes and some couldn't count to ten using their fingers.
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The green ramp war cry...RIGGER!!!
...and I believe only folks that have a GT of 110 or higher should be riggers...not a job you can make mistakes in....thanks fo doing it.
Chuckman
Senior Member
Everyone I was in with is pretty much at the end of their careers now, either close to retirement, or already passed that milestone.
This Friday I'm putting on the uniform one last time to deliver my buddy's oath, he got promoted to (Navy) captain (O6), which is a big deal.
I didn't know too many people who got out at their first or second enlistment, but then again in my community people stayed in for at least 10 years if not longer.
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I was in 76 - 96. Usaf; was on computer maintenance so no cat 4s on my shop. Did have some in base housing... omg... my daughter at 2 could out-think that guy.
Took the language test; with about 30 seconds left everything clicked into place but no time to answer questions. Probably for the best.
I worked with some folks who had GED's; no issues. Motivation counts for a lot.
My kids are out now but the stories they tell about changes... nope.
I would wind up in jail.
Took the language test; with about 30 seconds left everything clicked into place but no time to answer questions. Probably for the best.
I worked with some folks who had GED's; no issues. Motivation counts for a lot.
My kids are out now but the stories they tell about changes... nope.
I would wind up in jail.
Deplorable me
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just need warm bodies to teach them how to kill but not how to keep from being killed. Fodder...
RedneckFur
Smith & Wesson is a religion of peace.
IMHO, recruitment numbers being down are a good thing.
Chuckman
Senior Member
Why? Curious as to your thoughts on this.
Not long ago Biden proclaimed he was sifting out radical candidates, meaning Trump supporters. He also proclaimed he would replace them with people in struggling families. Basically it meant low quality recruits.
If the military tells people they can earn a path to a college education as an enticement they are missing the boat. If you are in the a low bracket and straight out of high school, you will get 75% of the tuition and housing free. And Biden may forgive the rest now. Other than TriCare there is little incentive to join enlisted. Sure not the pay.
If the military tells people they can earn a path to a college education as an enticement they are missing the boat. If you are in the a low bracket and straight out of high school, you will get 75% of the tuition and housing free. And Biden may forgive the rest now. Other than TriCare there is little incentive to join enlisted. Sure not the pay.
Straight civilian, never served, but at least with the MOS that works with me, haven't had many problems.
I work with 17C's and a few 35N.
All of them are really smart. A good chunk of them aren't straight out of high school, but mid 20's, and join after working a few years.
Maybe it's bad for 11B, but for the specialized skills, I think it's pretty unaffected.
I work with 17C's and a few 35N.
All of them are really smart. A good chunk of them aren't straight out of high school, but mid 20's, and join after working a few years.
Maybe it's bad for 11B, but for the specialized skills, I think it's pretty unaffected.
Chuckman
Senior Member
People from the bottom third of the economic strata have always been high priority, but boot camp/basic and follow on training have always been the great equalizer regardless of one's background. I do not know that they screen "who did you and/or your parents vote for?" in recruiting, but maybe they do.
Not every teen is a lazy sack of crap. If I was 18, with this economy, if I wanted more than meh wages I could see housing/food/travel, plus skill training, plus medical, plus GI Bill as an enticement.
I was curious about numbers and found this (army):
Facts and Figures
recruiting.army.mil
What I found interesting is that medical is overmanned; every officer in medical (MD, RN, PT/OT, PA/NP) can make much more out of uniform than in. Other interesting info on here.
Another good article about challenges:
Military Recruiting Faces Its Biggest Challenge in Years
Since the transition to an all-volunteer force in 1973, there have been years when the military services missed their recruiting goals. These include 1999, 2005, and 2018 when either the economy was booming or casualties in a conflict were perceived high.
www.heritage.org
So from I what I am reading, it isn't 'just Biden,' or 'just being a fat ass', or just 'economy', it's a bunch of factors.
@Chuckman Dunno about the Navy, but Army was fulla doctors who'd gone to med school in Grenada, or Dom Rep.
Never took the DLAB, but learned German on my own & maintained a 2+/3 or 3/3 on the DLPT. Tried like hell to go to language school while in PSYOP, but yOu HaVe A lAnGuAgE AlReAdY! Rather than have me learn a tactically useful language & maybe have fun for a couple months in school, they'd rather pay me $300/MO for a language with no military benefit.
I used to always get the stink eye from the nascent wokesters on jumps. Seems not everyone appreciated "yo, sup rigga" & "my rigga". 😆
Never took the DLAB, but learned German on my own & maintained a 2+/3 or 3/3 on the DLPT. Tried like hell to go to language school while in PSYOP, but yOu HaVe A lAnGuAgE AlReAdY! Rather than have me learn a tactically useful language & maybe have fun for a couple months in school, they'd rather pay me $300/MO for a language with no military benefit.
I used to always get the stink eye from the nascent wokesters on jumps. Seems not everyone appreciated "yo, sup rigga" & "my rigga". 😆
RedneckFur
Smith & Wesson is a religion of peace.
Military spending counts for 1/3 of the Fed budget, and is one of the primary things responsible for the absolutely asinine levels of debt this country is in.
Our military budget is more than the next 9 highest military spending countries, combined. Playing world police is not our job, and we don't need a worldwide military to protect our borders here at home.
Chuckman
Senior Member
The Last Outlaw
Well-Known Member
I agree we shouldn’t be the world’s police, but we have too many enemies that would love to see us slash our military budget. Having a strong military is one of the only reasons we are still as powerful as we are.
Biden and that sack of shit diversity hire Loyd Austin referred to disallowing radicalized recruits who had social media supporting Trump. Voting for Trump made you a radical.People from the bottom third of the economic strata have always been high priority, but boot camp/basic and follow on training have always been the great equalizer regardless of one's background. I do not know that they screen "who did you and/or your parents vote for?" in recruiting, but maybe they do.
Not every teen is a lazy sack of crap. If I was 18, with this economy, if I wanted more than meh wages I could see housing/food/travel, plus skill training, plus medical, plus GI Bill as an enticement.
I was curious about numbers and found this (army):
Facts and Figures
recruiting.army.mil
What I found interesting is that medical is overmanned; every officer in medical (MD, RN, PT/OT, PA/NP) can make much more out of uniform than in. Other interesting info on here.
Another good article about challenges:
Military Recruiting Faces Its Biggest Challenge in Years
Since the transition to an all-volunteer force in 1973, there have been years when the military services missed their recruiting goals. These include 1999, 2005, and 2018 when either the economy was booming or casualties in a conflict were perceived high.
So from I what I am reading, it isn't 'just Biden,' or 'just being a fat ass', or just 'economy', it's a bunch of factors.
RedneckFur
Smith & Wesson is a religion of peace.
The founding fathers warned against that sort of thinking.
Chuckman
Senior Member
The founding fathers also understood the strength of a Navy for keeping sea lanes open and power and projection. I'm not sure they wanted us to have a small military, but they did not want us to have a large, standing army that would be used as a force of occupation against our own people.
OP
The current occupation force is the police. Police forces as they are today did not exist back in late 1700's, it's a fairly modern concept.
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RedneckFur
Smith & Wesson is a religion of peace.
They also warned against getting involved in "Europe's wars" (military conflicts that do not involve us directly). One of the problems with having a large military is that once you do, you start finding reasons to use it. And the more you use it, the more funding it seems to need. Its an issue that feeds on itself. Since the end of WW1, it seems we've found a way to get our boots on the ground in half the counties around the world and a good many of their conflicts.
Chuckman
Senior Member
I'm tracking. I agree with this. But one thing about a large military is deterrence. There are ways to do this without 1.75 million people in uniform and forward staging in other countries, but you have to put people out there, and the military has to be competent.
Exactly what has historically happened and will continue to happen.
Golf courses, polo grounds, stables, recreation centers, bowling alleys, splash pads, swimming pools, million dollar plus NATO houses for other country officers, marinas, tennis facilities, skeet and clay ranges, etc… Maybe a few of these on a base but damn well out of control.
Oh the horror! God forbid we have some sort of morale, welfare and recreation opportunities for the service members and their dependents at our bases they’re assigned to!
So, No.
3/4 of the MWR locations you speak of are paid from the profits from the sale of goods on the exchanges.
As an example, if a service member or family shop on-post, all the profits go to MWR, 20% stays on the base the shopping accrued in, and the other 80% goes to the general fund. Yes some tx money does fall into MWR, but its mostly for land buys and securing construction loans.
John
This is the very logic that makes people NOT want to join, or at the very least, reenlist. Just because you had shitty quality of life, does it mean the next guy should too? God forbid service members find a way to enjoy themselves. Invest in your people and maybe retention would be better.
They could tear down old moldy barracks and people would still complain "we had worse!". Give me a break.
Just got back from golf on base and swimming at the base pool. Enjoyed it. Problem for me is they pay enlisted men shit and spend money on stuff they still charge to enjoy. $40 for one round, $6 pp pool and and an enlisted soldier gets garbage for salary. Soldiers still pay to use those facilities. The priorities are all wrong.
My friend who is a plumber went to a Charleston base to work in 2021. Him and one other worker had a $330k project. He cleared after all expenses and supplies $240k for 6 months at 4 days a week. Then he went back and did a transgender bathroom for $48k with a cost of $3800. Transgender bathroom I say again. Damn military leadership are idiots.
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DrScaryGuy
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If it makes you feel any better, today at work i heard "oh you/re in the military? i am too"
the one speaking was a tiny tiny young filipina that i hope has some very useful skill because the recoil from a 22short might knock her over
she was speaking to a young black woman who had neck rolls with the dark pigment in them that suggests a solid case of diabetes is developing.
and now they want to lower the bar again?
I am concerned about our fighting forces.
the one speaking was a tiny tiny young filipina that i hope has some very useful skill because the recoil from a 22short might knock her over
she was speaking to a young black woman who had neck rolls with the dark pigment in them that suggests a solid case of diabetes is developing.
and now they want to lower the bar again?
I am concerned about our fighting forces.
ES44AC
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I believe it depends on the individual and what will be required in that specific job. You don't want a complete idiot, but common sense is a good start. I've seen many college educated people that are also complete idiots and no common sense.
Lowering standards destroyed in the long run.
beeleafs
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aight then, my story... I struggled in HS, seriously! I had to pass pre-Algebra, as a senior in High School, to graduate (it's OK to laugh). I was lost, no self-esteem, undisciplined, highly unsupervised, and had no clue of what to do in life while growing up and living in a small "mill town" in central NC. I know my "story" is not everyone's reality or what they were called to do, but for me "the lights turned on and everything made sense"! Hard stipes in about 24 months, Honor graduate from Ranger School, honor graduate from DS School, ect. If the standard is public education and standardized testing (whatever that is) is the litmus test, I think we are selling ourselves short and I am on the outside looking in. The military saved my life! That and my faith is what I attribute as to why I am where I am. Debt free, self employed and a $10+ mil annual sales. If I had been denied entrance into "service" based on academic knowledge and testing performance alone, then I would probably be incarcerated or dead. I am not saying a HS diploma and a basic education is not important, I am just saying that sometimes, there are extenuating circumstances and some guys (and OK, gals) just need someone to believe in them and a chance and an opportunity to excel in a structured environment. Maybe I am an exception, maybe there are other exceptions.
define and help me understand standards....
define and help me understand standards....
My son took over a command two weeks ago. He had a low number at 93 soldiers. I asked him how retention and recruitment was going. He says not well. He is a couple months from his unit dropping to 73 soldiers and there are others having decreased numbers. They fudged the numbers last year after announcing 30% behind with a month to go. I cannot believe any numbers the military reporting at this point. Nobody wants to look bad.
They are not telling the truth. Biden and his appointment are bad for the armed services. The marines have similar issues. No idea about the truth with the Navy and Air Force. I assume with the Air Force being small and less likely to be deployed or boots on the ground their numbers are not near as bad. We have seen all the woke ads the Army is producing. No way these entice the young men who typically join.
They are not telling the truth. Biden and his appointment are bad for the armed services. The marines have similar issues. No idea about the truth with the Navy and Air Force. I assume with the Air Force being small and less likely to be deployed or boots on the ground their numbers are not near as bad. We have seen all the woke ads the Army is producing. No way these entice the young men who typically join.