Excessive amount of copper/bronze particles in the barrel?

ulflyer

ulflyer

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After shooting the first 60-80 223's in a new Del-Ton carbine I find what seems to me to be an excessive amount of copper/bronze particles in the barrel. They were very noticeable on the first patches, and even after using a bore brush, and running numerous wet patches through, I still found a lot of particles shining on the patches when I gave it up.

The rifle was new and I had run a couple patches through before shooting so it was clean to begin with.

The ammo was boxed PMC Bronze like this: https://trueshotammo.com/ammunition/rifle-ammo/223-rem/pmc-ammo/pmc-bronze-223-rem-55-grain-fmj/

The cleaner was M-Pro and G96.

I had a Del-Ton several years ago and don't recall anything like this, but know very little about this type rifle.

Does the above seem normal? Do I have a problem?
 
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Have pics? Copper usually bonds vigorously to the bore. How'd it group? If visible pieces of jacket were separating it wouldn't. Unburned powder frequently looks bronzy.
 
I don't have any pics but I could run the patches back and forth between my fingers and feel the sharpness of the particles. They shined under a desk lamp. The cases that I collected looked fine. I was mainly shooting close up, off my back porch to test function with no real targets, but did try a few at about 200 ft and hit a 12 inch metal plate a couple times. My feeling is its reasonably accurate.
 
Tucci454 said:
Go mag dump it then post a picture of the patch.
Click to expand...
I wish I could but I have no idea how to post pics. There are still a few of us old dinosaurs left. I have some Fiochii 223's....I'll run a mag of those thru prob tomorrow and report back. There is no question in my mine but that the copper coating on the bullets is coming off. Wondering if the rifle bore is not as smooth as it should be and how can I tell?
 
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If it were me the first step would be to figure out if it is copper jacket material or brass from the case that is the culprit.

It is not unusual for a new AR15 barrel to scratch the brass as it moves up the barrel extension into the chamber, the edges of the extension may have sharp edges that need to be knocked down. This condition leaves small brass flakes or chips in the chamber and bolt lug recess area that may work their way down the barrel during firing.

The more likely cause is a burr at the gas port or a flaw in the barrel that is ripping copper material off the bullet jacket, these burrs are often worn away with use. Inspecting the barrel with a bore scope is a huge help in this situation.
 
How is accuracy, and do you have scratches on the bullet after clambering(not firing)?
 
I just got home and will try to take some pics tomorrow after I have shot it some more. I've looked at fired cases and bullets after chambering and see nothing unusual. I do reload pistol ammo so have general familiarity with brass.
 
Seems to be definitely brass.
Perhaps it is not from the barrel but from the barrel extension/locking lugs? If there are sharp edges on the feed ramps ( which I have seen) it will shave brass off the case. If you cleaned from the breech you could pick up this brass with the cleaning patch without ever seeing it?
 
keepcalmandcarryon said:
Seems to be definitely brass.
Perhaps it is not from the barrel but from the barrel extension/locking lugs? If there are sharp edges on the feed ramps ( which I have seen) it will shave brass off the case. If you cleaned from the breech you could pick up this brass with the cleaning patch without ever seeing it?
Click to expand...
I cleaned from the muzzle end. After loading and extracting 3 live rounds there were no unusual
scratches on the bullet or cases. I'm going to try to shot some more tomorrow. I've run more patches thru till there are no significant amount of metal showing.
 
Didn't have time Saturday to test fire, but today I've hauled out a chair and table to prop on and put up some targets to get ready for hopefully, a warmer day shortly. I do want to solve this issue of copper/bronze shedding, and may need to call DelTon to see about a return. Going to shoot Fiochii only this time instead of PMC.
 
Shot a mag today and the results were fantastic! No more metallic particles and the accuracy was great. I'll never know what caused it, but if I had to guess I'd go with what Clicker said in Post #6 about a rough edge somewhere that initially scratched the cases and maybe this "edge" has now been worn off

I would have shot more but the trigger pin loosened so it took it in the house to be fixed and was eager to run a patch through to see how it looked.

To all of you who responded, thanks a lot, it was really appreciated. Jeppo, extra thanks for posting the pics for me.
 
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