HandLoading 300 BLK, Anyone?

Michael458

Michael458

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First, I don't look at HandLoading as merely reloading something. Reloading to me is something you do with cheap loads in 45 ACP, or some other handgun loads. Cheap, lead mostly, reload, go shoot again.

HandLoading is Not reloading........ HandLoading is Science. You make lots of components come together, to make something you cannot buy. A special bullet perhaps. Or another special requirement or need, or even desire.

I approach most all cartridges this way, and we investigate different aspects rigorously to get what we require, need, or desire.

I never thought much about 300 BLK until my middle son decided to get one. He ended up with a 8.2 inch barrel "pistol" in July of 2015. I think he knew at some point I would get interested in loading and messing with it, or he certainly hoped I would anyway.

Very long story, somewhat short, I did get interested, when I saw there was not much available out there that would enhance this cartridge. It was not long before I had a few 16 inch rifles. I started looking at potential of the mini .308 caliber cartridge, and real bullets available. There were only a few, but some decent choices at any rate in 110 gr. Now 300 BLK in my mind is the perfect Zombie gun. At least, at this point in time, in mixed company, we will use Zombie as the word for vermin and varmints.

After a good bit of test work, in the end, I redesigned the Perfect 300 BLK bullet, a 100 gr Flat Base Raptor from Cutting Edge Bullets. This is THE TICKET for 300 BLK. Proven in the fields for deer/pigs/bear as well.



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300 BLK makes an incredible little cartridge for beginning hunters, "with the proper bullet" of course...
This young man is from NC actually, and in addition to the family being B&M fans, he is also a 300 BLK fan, and took this nice bear, one shot, 70 yards. After smashing scapula, and the base of the 100 Raptor exited far side, bear went 20 feet and fell over stone cold...........And these sort of stories are numerous with deer and pigs, and kids. Figure if they do bears this good, Zombies don't have a chance.

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There are a few other really good bullets out there as well........... If anyone is interested, then maybe we can get some dialog going here and discuss some serious HandLoading, bullet choices, pressures and platforms........ Since 2015 I have become a huge 300 BLK fan, but mostly because of what it can do with the proper bullet.

Michael
 
I'm a fan of .300BLK and handload for it. Unfortunatley, It disappointed me twice this fall when both my son and I lost deer that had good shot placement with an 8.5" barrel and 125gr Nosler BTs. \
I now think the 8.5" barrel just can't drive those fast enough to do the job. We're talking less than 1700fps with near max H110 loads. Now the 110 barnes Tax-TX is supposedly the heat for shorter barrels with less velocity.
My neighbor uses a 10.5" pistol and harvested a nice fat doe with the Tac-Tx this fall.
 
Ikarus1....... Yeah, I think 8.5 is way short on the 120s...... Terminal Performance most certainly would not be up to snuff at 1700 fps at any distance. I have several 8.5 inch guns, I run the 100 Raptor at anything from 2275 up to 2325 fps, depending on that particular barrel, but most common is just under 2300 fps. I much prefer, and advise anyone to stay with the 10.5 inch barrels for better terminal ballistics, same bullet at 2375 to 2400 fps, pressures run average of 54000 PSI.

Weight equal pressure, various 110s at are 2150 or so in 8.5 inch guns. I have several 8.5s and several 10.5s, the 10.5s are top end....... for short guns. The same 100 Raptor load runs 2550 fps in 16 inch guns.
 
Ikarus1 said:
My neighbor uses a 10.5" pistol and harvested a nice fat doe with the Tac-Tx this fall.
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Right behind the 100 FB Raptor, this Barnes TAC is also a favorite bullet of mine as well..... If I didn't have Raptors, this would be the bullet.............
 
I'm a fan.

I've used Barnes TacTx factory loads the last several whitetail season. Never had a deer take more than a step or two with them. That's with 16" barrels that my son and I are using. I have a 10.5" pistol but have not yet had the opportunity to take a shot on game with it.

For "social purposes" I keep that 10.5" loaded with 110gr Hornady Vmax. I've shot a couple of deer with that too. The only reason I don't use it regularly for deer hunting is no exit wound. The reason I keep it loaded for "social purposes" is that I'm not going to have to track the badguy through a thicket after a less than optimal shot. But what it does inside a body cavity is just evil......
 
Ikarus1 said:
We're talking less than 1700fps with near max H110 loads. Now the 110 barnes Tax-TX is supposedly the heat for shorter barrels with less velocity.
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Since you mentioned it, my loads of 18.2gr H110 under 125gr Speer TNT chrono at 1840fps out of my BA 8” barrels. Totally agree that the Tac-TX is THE load for .300BLK, it’s my HD load.
 
rantingredneck said:
I'm a fan.
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Yep... Me too. So much so, I just counted firearms I have data on, and the number is 18 of the things... HEH HEH..... So yeah, I am a believer in 300 BLK for lots of purposes.........I may have more, not 100% sure of that, but that is on the data sheets for loads tested and velocities........... I keep several 10.5 inch guns close to hand........

I too like the Hornady bullet, I have been shooting the 110 Zombie, 500 to a box. Terminal performance is acceptable for Zombies. It also shoots close enough to POI with the main load, which for all my 300 BLKs is the 100 FB Raptors. All rifles/pistols sighted for the 100 Raptor load, and most of them shoot the Barnes TAC and Hornady Zombie to either same, or close enough to same POI at 50 yards.

I have several buddies that have used the 100 Raptor for deer and such, they don't have to track any of those, or never have anyway. But, there is always two holes, so if they did have to track, it would not be far and it would be rather evident. Lots of blood from Raptors............
 
Jerzsubbie said:
Since you mentioned it, my loads of 18.2gr H110 under 125gr Speer TNT chrono at 1840fps out of my BA 8” barrels. Totally agree that the Tac-TX is THE load for .300BLK, it’s my HD load.
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That might work with a varmint bullet like the TNT, I'm sure it's plenty to make it fragment. It's just not enought umff for a controlled expansion BT designed for .308 velocities. The TacTX was designed for .300blk, and there's a few other 110-ish grain projectiles coming on the market for that purpose.

IDK if I can stomach the .60 per bullet cost of the Cutting Edge raptors for just general purpose but if they work like @Michael458 says then it would be worth me getting a box or 2 and playing around with during deer season
 
Ikarus1 said:
IDK if I can stomach the .60 per bullet cost of the Cutting Edge raptors for just general purpose but if they work like @Michael458 says then it would be worth me getting a box or 2 and playing around with during deer season
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HEH... Yeah, well you don't have to have a lot. Get some, try them. I use 100 FB Raptors with 20.3/WW 296 Federal or Winchester Primers, 54000-55000 PSI. 16 inches 2530-2550 fps, 12 inches 2430 fps, 10.5 inches from 2330 fps to 2380 fps depending on individual gun, 8.5 inches 2275 fps average of different guns. Friend has some sort of 5 inch gun and they tested at 2050 fps in it.

Here is what 2500 of mine looked like...... a few weeks ago...... I don't waste my money, so I figure its worth it for me to have a few magazines of this laying around when the Zombies come knocking...
Oh, and this is after I bought 4000 a year or so ago. I also load this in 308 Winchester and other .308 caliber guns

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I've mostly loaded 300BLK for plinking purposes. I've not shot that one in a while because my source for boolits that I'd worked up disappeared. I'm not to keen on going through the load development stuff again! But this thread has me thinking I need to get back at it.
 
I have loads, but most of this is with the 100 Raptors, various 110s and a few loads in 115 and 120............. I don't care much for 300 BLK as suppressed, or any .308 for that matter at 1050 fps or so. I am looking for top end Terminal Performance. I use almost exclusively WW 296, has proven to be as good, better than most others....... I have pressure data on everything.

Friend of mine, also in NC....He is quoted below.

have an area on the farm that always seems to have a big deer. I noticed that there were more tracks and signs of activity in this area again this year. I wanted to try the 300 Blackout on something besides paper for a change. I used the rifle I set up first for just supersonic loads with 19.0gr of H110 and the original 100gr Raptor. I shot the deer slightly quartering away at 60yds. The bullet went in behind the left shoulder and exited center of the right shoulder. The top of the heart was gone and the lungs looked like jello run thru a blender. This deer weighed just over 200lbs live weight.

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This is Ed's Grandson and Ed's quote....................

My grandson’s first deer taken this morning at 7:00AM. He was shooting one of my 300 blackouts with the suppressor and 100gr Raptors. He shot it at 75yds off shooting sticks which was incredible to me. He was shaking so hard the first time he stood up to the rifle and looked thru the scope that I had him sit back down and just watch the deer for a few minutes. When he stood up the second time he was all business. Facing us at 75yds, he shot it center of the neck and down it went DRT. Logan is 10.

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Another Friend of mine here in SC his daughter shot this hog...........


Syd shot this 200lb hog tonight at 70 yards in the shoulder with the 300 blackout Raptor. He bled like crazy and went about 15 yards.

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And the list goes on and on...............

We are all fortunate, there are lots of good bullets for this little cartridge...............
 
The best source of good quality brass that I have found is Everglades. They form it from MilSpec 223 and do a really good job with it. I have been a little OCD with this last batch of 3500 pieces. You can get by in most cases no issues at all with just prime and load. However, my OCD got me, so I had to size it all in my small base die. They had water spots on them, so that was driving me insane. I finally got one of the Frankford Arsenal Rotary "Washers", and was extremely pleased with the outcome, but only after drying in the Lyman dryer. No water spots....... Brass was proper then.......

BEFORE

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AFTER

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https://www.evergladesammo.com/brass/rifle-brass/300-aac-blackout-reloading-brass.html
 
It's a fun round and super versatile. Think about it, what other round do you load that has a 145Gr spread from 100gr to 245gr! I love that you can load just about anything into it and it performs pretty well. I've got a box of 30-30 165gr to do next. I mocked one up and it fed ok after a quick buff of the ramp. BUt seriously, if any .308 bullets are on sale, you can probably load em this case and get decent results.
 
Have any of you loaded 200 gr subsonic? Haven't seen much data on the Hodgdon reloading page for it.
 
SSgt75 said:
Have any of you loaded 200 gr subsonic? Haven't seen much data on the Hodgdon reloading page for it.
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I do heavier subsonics. 220-245. Seems easier to keep them subsonic the heavier they are. let me findthe pdf I found.

http://www.accuratepowder.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/300_ACC_Blackout_Data.pdf

Got some more data off a few sites and then at battery oaks tested my 245gr Missouri Bullets lead from
10.5 to 11.0gr A1680

https://missouribullet.com/details.php?prodId=204&category=6&secondary=

10.6 - 11gr cycled best out of my 8.5" barrel. SUPER fun to shoot too.
 
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Never really messed much with the SubSonic 300 BLK.... Played with some BlueDot I think...... I had some test work to do at SubSonic.. and that is about it... 6.5/BlueDot gave 990 with a 150 for the tests........
 
I do reload 300BLK and I've wiled away the winter evenings making brass from 223 but I only hunt paper and steel. Mine wears a can so I worked up a decent heavy sub-sonic plinker for range time. I have not got round to true - as you say - handloading for the 300 BLK yet but it's on my to-do list. One of my favorite things to do with a new shooter is hand them the big scary black rifle with a suppressor and let them ring a gong with these red 200gn coated "lipstick" rounds I've made. Never fails to make them smile.
 
Catfish said:
I do reload 300BLK and I've wiled away the winter evenings making brass from 223 but I only hunt paper and steel. Mine wears a can so I worked up a decent heavy sub-sonic plinker for range time. I have not got round to true - as you say - handloading for the 300 BLK yet but it's on my to-do list. One of my favorite things to do with a new shooter is hand them the big scary black rifle with a suppressor and let them ring a gong with these red 200gn coated "lipstick" rounds I've made. Never fails to make them smile.
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same here I have the cutting saw, jig and now a newly acquired WFT in .300blk to make my trimming much faster and easier. I really like using Lake City blanks for brass since it's pretty much useless for anything else ;)

I can usually pick up blanks for free after Robin Sage if you know where to look, but Everglades also sells 1K for $49 which is a bargain IMO.
 
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Sam and I were working on 358 MGP, had two guns made. I looked at brass, bought basic from Starline, while I was at it, I bought some basic 223. Having a vision of cutting, trimming, forming, 7.62X40... big BLK if you don’t know, just a little longer. I cut, trimmed formed, trimmed again, maybe 50 pieces, decided to just buy the damn stuff, was taking too much time. I bought 250 pieces. One day..... Maybe....... But, definitely the way to play with the 358, always easier to go down in size, from basic, than to go up.......

For 300 BLK, no way, not as long as EverGlades has brass..........

I like 300 BLK for Zombies and such. Just so happens it makes a great gun for kids, and with the right bullets, extremely effective. No, I have never hunting with one at all, fact is, I don’t hunt deer anyway. .308 is more effective for my purpose close range, than 223. A short 300 BLK is so far ahead of 9mm in the terminal area, its not even up for discussion. Even 8 inch guns at 2275 fps are way ahead of any 9mm gun in the same size. 223 comes to good effect at 10.5 to 11 inches. Yes, the little 300 BLK has lots of advantages for many applications. I had a bolt gun done from one of the WIn M70s in 223. It’s 16 inches, set up with strain gages, and is a perfect test platform for pressures. I keep 300 BLK to around 55000 for most loads. I might push a few to 56000 but only a few. This way, it works well in anything you put it in, 8-10.5 or 16 inches...... Bolt or Semi.......... I was late to the game with 300 BLK, but I am all on board now........... Good stuff..............
 
.300 blackout is the perfect round for deer and kids. We killed two deer last yr with the Federal 120gr TC rounds and neither took a step. Both were high shoulder shots at 50-60 yards with very minimal meat loss. My then 7yr old daughter approved. I don't wanna be in front of her if she's toting my 10.5" AR pistol.
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Ikarus1 said:
I've used them and the same data from the Nosler 125gr BTs interchangebly
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I failed to be clear.
I've several hundred of them, Cabelas messed up and I got them for $9/100. Does anyone have feedback on performance and best load combination
I've an 8.5" and a 10" BLK.
Thx
 
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I really have not found a powder that is actually better than WW 296. That is with higher velocity and lighter bullets that the 300 BLK is capable of. H-110 that I have tested reached higher pressures before reaching the velocities of WW 296, missing top end velocity by just a bit, not a lot, but enough not to bother. It seems H-110 is the preferred powder, but, even still, I like the WW 296 better overall. LilGun loads that I have tried with some heavier bullets at 120-125 reached pressure quick, and short some on velocity. I have not revisited it, since WW 296 was doing so well. That might be something more to look at, as recently I revisited LilGun with the 7.62X40, and gained a 100 fps with the 100 Raptor, and less pressure to boot!

Has anyone used any LilGun with lighter 110s? Not really sure I really want to know! Since I just mixed up a 32 lb blend of WW 296 and tested. I always take the entire batch of powder, pour it all out in a 5 gallon CLEAN NEW And DRY bucket, mix it, pour it all back in original containers, and label so. This way, currently I have a 32 lb mix of WW 296 that is going to be exactly the same. I have found many many times, lots of variance in powders, even from one container to the next, in the same Lot#. WW 296 is mostly stable, I have not found issues with it. But go over to the Reloader powders, and there are differences from 1 lb to the next.

Tried some Shooters World Black (I think that is what it is called) in 358s the other day along with CFE Black, but that is way too slow for 110s and 300 BLK........... About the same or close to AA 1680.

Any thoughts on powders?
 
I was under the distinct impression that Win 296 and H110 was the same powder made by ADI inc. and packaged by Hodgdon
 
Pink_Vapor said:
I faile to be clear.
I've several hundred of them, Cabelas messed up and I got them for $9/100. Does anyone have feedback on performance and best load combination
I've an 8.5" and a 10" BLK.
Thx
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I did one load with 125 Nosler and 17/WW 296, Velocity was 2100 fps in 16 inches of gun, but pressure ran 58000 PSI, a tad over max of 55000. Probably drop it to 16-16.5/WW 296 for 2050 or so, but that would be 16 inches. 17/LilGun gave me 2100 fps also, but with a 125 Hornady at 56800 PSI....... I never went any further with 125s...... Have no idea what they might do in 8.5 or 10.5 inches. But not much. Shooting and plinking I am sure they would be dandy........
 
Ikarus1 said:
I was under the distinct impression that Win 296 and H110 was the same powder made by ADI inc. and packaged by Hodgdon
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I hear thru the grapevine the same thing. However, what I have tested they are not the same, or there might be a variance involved of some sort. And, I the H110 that I tested was not the current H110.
 
Win 296 has been the best for me, CFE BLK is also very good. H110 isn't bad either, but it didn't seem to work well with weaker charges.

For subsonics…… a shorter barrel is fine, but with supersonic ammo, a longer barrel is needed to achieve a velocity suitable for medium game, I've had some very consistent loads with a 125 grain MatchKing at just under 2200 fps.

I found this useful data recently...…. https://sierrabulletsblog.com/2017/12/21/sierra-bullets-300-aac-blackout-load-data/
 
My 300 BLKs have made a fine accounting for Foxes around the house here. Last year I shot six of the buggers. All at night, all lurking around out back. I had kittens that year, and I went to war with the local fox population. Last night I saw three, but no shots fired, YET. I am hunting tonight, waiting on zero dark thirty. All the fox shooting has been done with one of the 10.5 inch guns and the 100 Raptors. Don't matter where you hit them, they are down right there. Some needed finishing. Those were running at the shot. I am not a good running shot, nearly always shoot too far back, but no matter. All were also shot with Crimson Trace Green Lasers. And 800 Lumen Streamlights....... Excellent combination..........

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H110 and W296 are the same powders. Any differences you see will be lot-t0-lot variance. Same goes for HP38 and W231.

Look at the Hodgdon online data - the data for H110 and W296 will be the same and list the same pressures. I don't think they would do this if they did not think the two were identical.

There was a lot of discussion about this on another forum, and finally one person posted a photo of two bottles - one W296 and one H110 - which had the same lot number on each.
 
Toprudder said:
H110 and W296 are the same powders. Any differences you see will be lot-t0-lot variance. Same goes for HP38 and W231.

Look at the Hodgdon online data - the data for H110 and W296 will be the same and list the same pressures. I don't think they would do this if they did not think the two were identical.

There was a lot of discussion about this on another forum, and finally one person posted a photo of two bottles - one W296 and one H110 - which had the same lot number on each.
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Yep found some more info about that. Those are not ADI powders, they're made by St. Marks in Florida which is a division of General Dynamics. Hodgdon just slaps 2 different labels on the same powder.
 
I've used Lil Gun but only with 125 gr. Nosler BT. It was a very consistent load. I've not yet reloaded any 110gr. bullets for .300BLK.
 
LilGun ended up just recently being the #1 powder for the 7.62X40. I had tried it, went past it, and then revisited it. I was able to gain 100 fps in both 100 Raptor and 110 Barnes TTSX. But I don't think the same is going to happen with the 300 BLK, it just does not have the capacity to make a big difference, I don't think. I doubt anyone here has run into what I call the "LilGun Phenomena". LilGun is a great powder in all of my B&M Super Shorts, .500, .474, and 458 calibers. But, at some point in compression, LilGun actually goes "backwards". The more you add, the less pressure you get, and the less velocity. A strange occurrence I have never experienced with any other powder. Fortunately I did not get to the point in the 7.62X40. LilGun can do some odd things. I think with the heavier bullets in caliber, LilGun might be the ticket, but in 300 BLK the biggest bullet I shoot is a 115 Lehigh and 110 Hornady and Barnes TAC. All the rest are 100 Raptors, and WW 296 seems to be about perfect. Not to mention the fact I have 32#s of WW 296 sitting on 300 BLK GO.

With lots of use for WW 296 also in the Super Shorts, I don't think investigating H110 is going to do anything for me here. Even if they are the same. But I definitely would not trust any powder, from one can to the next, even in the exact same lot#. I have seen major differences in various powders, not a lot in WW 296, but still would not trust without verify. Fortunately I have the exact equipment to do just that without too much hassle.
 
It's my go to powder in .45Colt. I load a 260 gr. WFN over 20.1 grains of Lil Gun. Absolute evil on whitetails out of my Rossi 1892 clone. I started using it when I got into .300 BLK because I already had it on hand (along with H110...)

Good to know about the lighter bullet issue in .300 BLK.
 
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BatteryOaksBilly said:
Have ya'll shot 38 Specials in a 4 inch Model 10? Same results
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Actually not that good. Caliber does make a difference at 1000 fps....... My opinion .308 at a 1000 fps ain't hitting on much, not in Terminal Performance terms, and I have tested them....... Personally, I could give a rats ass about SubSonic and Suppressors. But when we did the NFA Trust a few years ago, my boys wanted to add suppressors. We did two. I got interested enough to try some things and came to the conclusion for terminal performance at SubSonic Velocities, you are going to have to work damn hard to be a 45 ACP 230 grain anything. And, it comes like that straight out the box, is .451 caliber to start with, and expanding 45s work at those velocities. You have to have special designed .308 caliber bullets to get any sort of Terminal Performance, and even then sometimes comes up short. Run of the Mill basic .308 caliber subsonic is not hitting on much if anything at all............ You are not even going to drill a hole very far without special solid designs, common spritzers will not expand, pointy solids are not terminally stable, and will flip and go off course....... I know there is a lot of SubSonic fans around for the 300 BLK, I am not one of them, or any other sub 308 for that matter. Make it a 45 ACP, and you start to have something worth working with....... Now if you are just shooting and plinking that is one thing, but Terminal Performance is quite another.
 
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