RP and Trust question

JohnFreeman

JohnFreeman

The bane of my existence
Charter Life Member
Benefactor
Multi-Factor Enabled
Joined
Dec 17, 2016
Messages
8,234
Location
JoCo
Rating - 100%
57   0   0
Oh BW....

My spouse is an RP on my trust. This was done well before the issue of RP's being fingerprinted was a thing. I have not transferred any NFA items into my trust since then.

I am of the understanding that the requirement for fingerprints/etc for all RPs was not retroactive as long as no new NFA items are transferred into the trust. Is this correct?

Do I need to have my wife fingerprinted, etc if I now make use of the NFA amnesty for a Form 1'd pistol>SBR?
 
Nvm … not correct, deleted

I think the correct answer is ‘yes, and you will have to pay the tax’ because your trust did not own the item before the rule
 
Last edited:
JohnFreeman said:
Oh BW....

My spouse is an RP on my trust. This was done well before the issue of RP's being fingerprinted was a thing. I have not transferred any NFA items into my trust since then.

I am of the understanding that the requirement for fingerprints/etc for all RPs was not retroactive as long as no new NFA items are transferred into the trust. Is this correct?
Click to expand...
The only thing that matters is who is an RP when you submit. Changing RPs at any other time doesn’t involve notifying the ATF of anything. I think that’s what you’re asking?

JohnFreeman said:
Do I need to have my wife fingerprinted, etc if I now make use of the NFA amnesty for a Form 1'd pistol>SBR?
Click to expand...
Yes. If she’s an RP now, she’d need to provide prints & photos. And as Catfish points out, that pistol needed to be property of the trust prior to 1/31/23.
 
My wife is the beneficiary of my trust, and is not considered an RP
I am the initial grantor, and i'm the only RP.
It changes from time to time.
 
DrScaryGuy said:
My wife is the beneficiary of my trust, and is not considered an RP
I am the initial grantor, and i'm the only RP.
It changes from time to time.
Click to expand...
How does that work? I thought that’s how mine was but my first form 1 was denied because I didn’t provide her prints/picture. How can she take possession of the NFA items without being a RP?
 
I dunno, but silencershop reviewed it and let it through once i set it up that way. The lawyer who set it up that way said it should be fine without anything extra needed. i am not a lawyer.
As I understand it, having her listed as a beneficiary only means she's not an owner now, doesn't need the RP stuff, and has no expectation of ownership of them until I die, at which point it's a whole different game. I guess this way it's basically the same as doing it as an individual, but naming her as the successor ahead of time without doing the form 5. But with the flexibility to change it up on the fly.
again, no idea, not a lawyer.
 
barf said:
How does that work? I thought that’s how mine was but my first form 1 was denied because I didn’t provide her prints/picture. How can she take possession of the NFA items without being a RP?
Click to expand...
Last time we had this discussion, you said she was also a trustee…which is why she’s considered and RP:

6C6F976A-F5A4-4D8C-BC6C-18D41506933C.jpeg
 
Well, NFA items are an asset like any other item in an estate and if for example, it goes through probate, it'll be disbursed like anything. I think it will require a Form V to transfer in this manner.

Yes, thanks BW, my poorly formed question was whether RP's now need to go through all the BS now (FP, background check, etc).

Followup question: Does removing a RP require a notary/witnesses, or can I just create and sign the document and file it along with my existing trust paperwork?
 
barf said:
I still guess I just don’t understand how you can be a beneficiary and inherit the NFA items without being an RP/trustee.
Click to expand...
If the items are in the Trust, nothing inherited because the trust is perpetual until it is dissolved.
 
Button Pusher said:
If the items are in the Trust, nothing inherited because the trust is perpetual until it is dissolved.
Click to expand...
Not necessarily true.

If the beneficiary is not a trustee, then the firearms must transfer to the trustee via a Form 5 (tax-free) at the time of death, unless there’s another remaining trustee. At that point a background check will be done on the beneficiary.

The beneficiary will then be the registered owner, not the trust.
 
barf said:
I still guess I just don’t understand how you can be a beneficiary and inherit the NFA items without being an RP/trustee.
Click to expand...
See if my answer just above this clarifies that a bit.
 
Button Pusher said:
Yes, what advantage, if any, to removing the items from the trust to an individual?
Click to expand...
None that I know of.

The other (maybe better?) options are to either:
1. Make the current beneficiary a trustee
2. Create a new trust with the current beneficiary as the grantor, then change the current beneficiary to be the new trust (instead of the individual)

I currently have two trusts, and will probably make changes when my son (16) turns 18. I’ll make him a trustee on both, and create a new trust for him that will be the beneficiary of both current trusts. Since he’s my only child, everything will be under one umbrella at that point.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom