I guess my question is, what do you consider “real” training? Is it training for self defense, close quarters small unit tactics, or large unit maneuver tactics? Would “real” training include insertion and extraction training, supply distribution, medical training, sanitation training or simply training to hide most of your body behind a wooden barrier?I do not fully agree with his viewpoint, but I do believe shooting competitions like IDPA are beneficial. I believe matches improve gun handling skills under stress better than anything else. It will show the flaws in your technique. And if you can keep this in mind when competing, then fine. But, it's easy to get caught up in the gamesmanship. Some matches impose "tactics" in their format. It really depends on who's running the match. I used to love North Wilksboro. Their motto was, Shoot till you're happy. They didn't care if you deviated from the format if you wanted too. Of course it might cost you the stage, but you were free to do so. And I've been to matches that were so ridgid and gamey, I never went back. What I don't agree with is his comment about being able separate what he says is just a drill from "real" training. Well, most people don't get "real" training. This is as close as they get. I can easily see sporting techniques getting ingrained, especially if there is no other training to counter it. You will default to your training techniques, the ones you do over and over due to muscle memory. Yes, I think competing is good, IF you can maintain the consciousness that it's just a drill. But, unless you invest in "real" training, how do you know the difference?
Just sayin'
I do not fully agree with his viewpoint, but I do believe shooting competitions like IDPA are beneficial. I believe matches improve gun handling skills under stress better than anything else. It will show the flaws in your technique. And if you can keep this in mind when competing, then fine. But, it's easy to get caught up in the gamesmanship. Some matches impose "tactics" in their format. It really depends on who's running the match. I used to love North Wilksboro. Their motto was, Shoot till you're happy. They didn't care if you deviated from the format if you wanted too. Of course it might cost you the stage, but you were free to do so. And I've been to matches that were so ridgid and gamey, I never went back. What I don't agree with is his comment about being able separate what he says is just a drill from "real" training. Well, most people don't get "real" training. This is as close as they get. I can easily see sporting techniques getting ingrained, especially if there is no other training to counter it. You will default to your training techniques, the ones you do over and over due to muscle memory. Yes, I think competing is good, IF you can maintain the consciousness that it's just a drill. But, unless you invest in "real" training, how do you know the difference?
Just sayin'
Had that happen here with the Fort Bragg Special Forces Team. These men travel and put on expos for civilians. I shot the draw and fire one round portion with them when they were here. We had about 100 people in all raising funds for the Special Forces Scholarship Fund.None of those guys like getting beat by an old fat guy
Speaking only for myself, I use to do some comps and enjoyed them for the most part. To me, the "real training" comes in the form of force on force, and even then depending on who runs the class, can be just like the comps kinda, in it can be crap or good. Force on force is the closest in my opinion you can get to the real thing, but it still has rules. Also, just like when I use to fight in grappling and mma tournaments, that's as close as you can get to real fighting, but it's still not "street fighting", as you still have rules. And as posted above, fof is just one aspect of "real training". As with anything, do what you think is best for you, and to hell with what anyone else thinks. Isn't it great, lol.Where do you go the invest in “real” training?
What is it and where do you go?
Real curious about this.
Speaking only for myself, I use to do some comps and enjoyed them for the most part. To me, the "real training" comes in the form of force on force, and even then depending on who runs the class, can be just like the comps kinda, in it can be crap or good. Force on force is the closest in my opinion you can get to the real thing, but it still has rules. Also, just like when I use to fight in grappling and mma tournaments, that's as close as you can get to real fighting, but it's still not "street fighting", as you still have rules. And as posted above, fof is just one aspect of "real training". As with anything, do what you think is best for you, and to hell with what anyone else thinks. Isn't it great, lol.
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We talked about force on force at Billy's last week, and I'm still interested in where I can get some training, and not having a lot of luck finding it. Any ideas?Speaking only for myself, I use to do some comps and enjoyed them for the most part. To me, the "real training" comes in the form of force on force, and even then depending on who runs the class, can be just like the comps kinda, in it can be crap or good. Force on force is the closest in my opinion you can get to the real thing, but it still has rules. Also, just like when I use to fight in grappling and mma tournaments, that's as close as you can get to real fighting, but it's still not "street fighting", as you still have rules. And as posted above, fof is just one aspect of "real training". As with anything, do what you think is best for you, and to hell with what anyone else thinks. Isn't it great, lol.
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http://defensiveconceptsnc.com/course-schedule/We talked about force on force at Billy's last week, and I'm still interested in where I can get some training, and not having a lot of luck finding it. Any ideas?
Billy asked if I'm afraid to have hands put on me, and I said no, and he asked if I'm afraid of being pushed to the ground, and I said I hope not to break a hip, but no, not afraid. lol.
I believe John Boyette does some FoF.We talked about force on force at Billy's last week, and I'm still interested in where I can get some training, and not having a lot of luck finding it. Any ideas?
Billy asked if I'm afraid to have hands put on me, and I said no, and he asked if I'm afraid of being pushed to the ground, and I said I hope not to break a hip, but no, not afraid. lol.
You ever taken a class with DCNC?http://defensiveconceptsnc.com/course-schedule/
coupon code trainhard for 40% off before 06.17.19
Great info, thanks!http://defensiveconceptsnc.com/course-schedule/
coupon code trainhard for 40% off before 06.17.19
How come?You ever taken a class with DCNC?
I did. Once. Never again.
Yes, shoothouse at TRC in 2016, carbine shooting around vehicles last summer, and others etc...You ever taken a class with DCNC?
I did. Once. Never again.
Horrible instructors. One of them has been on a couple of the local forums and is widely considered to be one of the most egotistical, cops are better than everybody, I know everything, bragging about injuring those he detained, etc, etc, people you’ll ever encounter in the industry.How come?
I guess my question is, what do you consider “real” training? Is it training for self defense, close quarters small unit tactics, or large unit maneuver tactics? Would “real” training include insertion and extraction training, supply distribution, medical training, sanitation training or simply training to hide most of your body behind a wooden barrier?
It’s been 30 years since I wore a uniform and even then most of the training we did was tearing down an AN/TPS63 Radar unit and seeing how fast we could get it loaded into a C130. I deployed twice to areas where combat was likely and only one of those deployments resulted in combat. We trained for each of those deployments for 1 week prior and the training was different each time and was based on the specific mission requirements. Other than that, we went to the rifle range once a year for qualification and did small unit maneuver training once a month, if lucky. I’m sure the grunts trained more often and SMU’s even more than that. I guess the point I’m trying to get at was that when a situation arises where you may have to defend yourself or those around you, you will know the difference and you cannot train for every scenario. You train for the constants and you adapt to the changes. Just the opinion of an old fat air winger.
@NKD, I could add more, but I'm traveling in the mountains right now, and I keep getting spotty reception, lol. For sure, the Connors, Jones, etc. far have a better chance when a fight breaks out, as does a guy who trains in FOF and also competition, as he will definitely see strengths and weakness's like FG said above. My MMA analogy kinda follows along the Jiu Jitsu guys, who want to hit the ground as soon as they engage, which in a street fight is the last place I want to be. I made it to Blue in BJJ, and that was enough for me, but spent WAY more time doing Muay Thai, Jeet Kune Do, and Kali/Silat. I wanted the kick boxing for a great stand up and clinch game, also the eye gouges and nastiness of JKD, and the very nasty weapons training of the Philippines, and I had the ground game covered. Put all that together with guns and FOF, and it makes for a great training session, haha. Actually, all the fight training gels very well with gun training. Let's see if this post, lol.
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Thanks man, but no one pays me much attention. At 5'-7", 155#s, people don't expect much, lol. And that's just the way I like it.Well, just for the record:
If a fight breaks out I’m on Stick Mans side!