Under Deck Deck

Tim

Tim

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I want to build a deck under this deck. The yard side will have a 2ft deep counter so I can work (day job, computer nerdery stuff) out there. I don’t anticipate entertaining or doing anything else here.

I have no desire to drill into the brick, so I’ll need to either sink posts along that wall or...and here’s my question...use those concrete piers.

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Thoughts on using these things? Of course I’d tie into the posts on the yard side, so the deck wouldn’t completely float.

The reality is, I don’t wanna dig post hole and pour cement that close to the foundation. Maybe I’m being silly, but it just feels like a bad idea.

10’x16’

B6F96AB4-C4FF-491E-9191-54EE1DB45CAA.jpeg
 
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Depending on the slope under your existing deck could you just level it and use pavers to make a patio?
 
NCFubar said:
Depending on the slope under your existing deck could you just level it and use pavers to make a patio?
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well, that right there is an idea.

the slope may be a bit too much for that. The backyard falls off pretty quickly down slope. I’d suspect there might be 4-6” drop from the wall to the outer posts. I certainly don’t want to interfere with drainage.
 
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I don’t think you can use those blocks on the house side. When I built mine, I had to drill into the brick and then use those blocks on the yard side. This was 15 yrs ago in a county that is different from yours, so ymmv
 
I built a small deck with those about 18 or 19 years ago. It’s still there.
 
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CAN you do it? Yes. Will it pass code? no.

As for whether or not it will work, that kinda depends on the soil characteristics. Those blocks don't have the same footprint as a footing, so they won't distribute the load well. If the soil is fill or soft/spongy, they could sink in some, there goes level, and the twist puts strain on the whole framework.

OTOH, if it's a "temporary" structure, and the soil is ok or you use more of them to carry the load, it would likely be ok for a while, maybe a long while. But you'd still have to deal with it again come sellin' time since it doesn't meet code.

EDIT: Also, those are typically for 4x4 posts. Current minimum for posts is 4x6. They're also cut for 2x cross members/joists, but then they'd have to be on level ground. If you've got to level the ground, might as well pour slab and go patio.
 
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I think the patio idea like mentioned above would be better suited and you mention slope concerns, the patio should have some slope so that water moves away from house. 2-3” drop over a 10 ft span is not that noticeable and usually what is needed for water to drain properly.
 
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Jp8819 said:
I think the patio idea like mentioned above would be better suited and you mention slope concerns, the patio should have some slope so that water moves away from house. 2-3” drop over a 10 ft span is not that noticeable and usually what is needed for water to drain properly.
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What’s the going rate for a 10x16 slab?
 
Tim said:
I want to build a deck under this deck. The yard side will have a 2ft deep counter so I can work (day job, computer nerdery stuff) out there. I don’t anticipate entertaining or doing anything else here.

I have no desire to drill into the brick, so I’ll need to either sink posts along that wall or...and here’s my question...use those concrete piers.

View attachment 335398
Thoughts on using these things? Of course I’d tie into the posts on the yard side, so the deck wouldn’t completely float.

The reality is, I don’t wanna dig post hole and pour cement that close to the foundation. Maybe I’m being silly, but it just feels like a bad idea.

10’x16’

View attachment 335400
Click to expand...

will they pass code? Meck county is pretty strict and yes they will. nothing wrong with free standing decks. why attach to the existing? sure doesn't look like your existing deck would pass inspection here. Meck county has a deck brochure you can use, your county may have one too. for footers here you can use (4) 4x8x16 blocks (two each way).
 
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I’d use the concrete prefab “castle stones” you showed. They work great as long as you get a nice and tight base for them to sit on.
 
Tim said:
Why do you say that?
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Your joists aren’t resting on top of a support. They’re only nailed/screwed to the columns.

You should run a piece of lumber up the length of the column to the bottom of the joists. Screw the piece to the column.
 
Why not combine the patio/paver idea with a free floating deck idea? If you use 4x4 or 4x6s, for your posts, the frame up would be on grade (ground level) at the house side and as you run your stringers out, cut the posts to a length that would make the frame level (away from the house side) put two pavers under those posts to prevent rot, frame it with your 2x8s or whatever you're going to use, run decking boards and walla..... Honestly, the biggest issue right now is going to be finding good wood at anything under astronomical prices.
 
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Comcrete solves all that and is the least cost. Level with footer and perimeter blocks on exposed sides. You can finish the concrete yourself. As long as you don’t ever enclose it you will be ok.
 
I used those block things for a small shed I built for my rental. They work well but one of my blocks has sank down some so the floor isn't level anymore...

I would drill into the brick if it was my house. Unless you have a basement or a really really deep footing if you go digging around your exterior wall you might hit footing and you don't want to mess around that. The soil around a footing is supposed to stay undisturbed.

CYA I'm not an engineer so take it with a grain of salt. I just draw triangles all day.
 
Tim said:
What’s the going rate for a 10x16 slab?
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Not sure but heard from a neighbor the other day concrete was up to $150 a yard without any finshing. With the price of lumber so high still bet concrete would be cheaper than lumber. Just guessing unless it needs alot of grading or framing you could get it done for around 2k
 
Jp8819 said:
Not sure but heard from a neighbor the other day concrete was up to $150 a yard without any finshing. With the price of lumber so high still bet concrete would be cheaper than lumber. Just guessing unless it needs alot of grading or framing you could get it done for around 2k
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Yeah, concrete has been cheaper than lumber for awhile now... And it looks like we are going to hit a shortage on high grade lumber again. MSR and SS in the big stuff

When high grade disappears the low grade stuff gets used fairly quickly. Sometimes it takes 2x as much 2x6 #1 to do what a 2x10 MSR does in a truss.
 
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Might be worth looking at attaching ledger to brick as done right above it. That eliminates foundation at house. Sure, seems creepy but it's done all the time. Just have to do it right.

If you wanted deck same depth as deck above it, you could utilize the existing deck support posts by way of a dbl. 2x beam at the yard side, with the joists going over those. These joists could also cantilever into the yard a bit if you needed. The counter could be framed between posts, which would provide vertical stiffness.

If you want it deeper, then of course you'll need to do your own footing/beam/etc on the yard side.
 
9outof10mms said:
Your joists aren’t resting on top of a support. They’re only nailed/screwed to the columns.
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Nah...just wasn't the focus of the picture. Joists are on a ledger board, I then put blocking between the joists to dress it up some.
 
Tim said:
Nah...just wasn't the focus of the picture. Joists are on a ledger board, I then put blocking between the joists to dress it up some.
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I should have used the word "header beam" instead of joist.

This is where I'm talking about...maybe it's an illusion or lack of clarity in the pic, but it looks like your header beams are attached to the outside of the column:
1.jpg

The header beam should be resting on something, not just secured by nails/screws/bolts. You're relying entirely on the shear strength of the metal fastener. For most residential uses, that's enough strength (assuming no corrosion). The failure is usually catastrophic and immediate collapse--usually happens when you have a party/gathering with a bunch of people who want to all be out on the deck.

It should be resting like this:
2.jpg

The repair (or "make it better solution") is to slap a piece of 2x lumber that's the same width as the column (looks like 4x4 or 6x6 in your case which would be a 2x4 or 2x6) to the column that creates a resting point for the beam.

Kind of like this, but in reverse (where the 2x4 would be under the beam and the top of the 4x4 would be flush with the top of the beam)...I can't find an exact pic of what I'm talking about:
f565bc3e2db9eb95d774dda4524f0de1.jpg


I don't mean to sound the alarm--odds are low that this will be a problem for you. It's an easy fix to get peace of mind though.
 
Don't forget the under deck roofing material.
Like Tuftex. We used that at our other house to keep the under deck patio dry.
Also use it for a roof on our pergola.
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Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk
 
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