ATF crack down on Ghost Guns in June 2022 and braced pistols in Aug 2022

backwoodsshooter said:
One section says they (completed 80% stuff) are grandfathered in. Another section they have to be serialized.

Clear as mud.
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Existing is grandfathered in, and it needs a serial for an FFL to sell it. You can keep it private to yourself and take no action. Point was to stop the sales of 80% kits.
 
Me. said:
Bumping this thread to raise awareness.

@JohnFreeman and @georgel have posted info in this thread regarding what's happening now.

Poly 80 is over

ATF has handed out cease and desist orders to the frame makers. JBT's doing JBT stuff.
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Get the gun parts you need to build a better firearm in the comfort of your home. Order your gun accessories and gear online from JSD Supply today.
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View attachment 472689
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One retailer got a boogeyman letter? Reminds me of the ares armor p80 ar15 stuff from years ago
 
Me. said:
We should merge https://carolinafirearmsforum.com/i...erning-the-frames-and-receivers.110805/page-5
into this thread.


I have now read the new rule document. It was a lot to read. I read it more out of curiosity than needing to know.

I also read it from the perspective of a private citizen who is not an FFL holder nor gunsmith. Not an importer nor manufacturer. Not even a guy who ever has or likely will make my own gun from scratch. Just a dude.

From the “just a dude“ standpoint, here are my major takeaways:

- The ruling makes clear what portion of a handgun is now the “frame” and what part of a long gun is the “receiver”.
- The ruling makes clear that only one component of the gun is the frame or receiver, and only that component needs to be serialized.
- Frames and receivers now include kits and frames/receivers that previously weren’t legally-classified as frames/receivers (what we commonly called 80%).
- The ruling makes somewhat clear what “readily” means.
- The ruling makes somewhat clear what is and isn’t a frame/receiver based on its level of completeness.
- The ruling makes it fairly clear what part of a silencer needs to be serialized.
- The ruling makes it somewhat clear what is a silencer, for those who have been getting over on the whole “solvent trap” thing.


My opinion (again, for the average dude)

- 80% receivers are now a thing of the past. No business will be making or selling them in a couple of months. There will be a big push to liquidate the stock. Prices won’t need to be reduced because gun buyers are about the most panicky group of people you’ll ever encounter. Folks will snap the remaining ones up. Prices might even go up and folks will call them “pre-ban” kits.

- Folks who DIY scratch-build guns are unaffected by the changes.

-Folks who have privately made firearms (PMF) who take them to a gunsmith better not leave them overnight, as they will be serialized when you get them back.

- The explanations and responses to the comments on the proposed ruling were pretty well thought out and written.
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If this hits things like hk flats and other oddball kit stuff I'm buying a spite printer
 
Me. said:
We should merge https://carolinafirearmsforum.com/i...erning-the-frames-and-receivers.110805/page-5
into this thread.


I have now read the new rule document. It was a lot to read. I read it more out of curiosity than needing to know.

I also read it from the perspective of a private citizen who is not an FFL holder nor gunsmith. Not an importer nor manufacturer. Not even a guy who ever has or likely will make my own gun from scratch. Just a dude.

From the “just a dude“ standpoint, here are my major takeaways:

- The ATF thinks their opinions have the weight of law and that they can override what has been passed by the legislature and executive branches.
- The ATF thinks their opinions have the weight of law and that they can override what has been passed by the legislature and executive branches.
- The ATF thinks their opinions have the weight of law and that they can override what has been passed by the legislature and executive branches.
- The ATF thinks their opinions have the weight of law and that they can override what has been passed by the legislature and executive branches.
- The ATF thinks their opinions have the weight of law and that they can override what has been passed by the legislature and executive branches.
- The ATF thinks their opinions have the weight of law and that they can override what has been passed by the legislature and executive branches.
- The ATF thinks their opinions have the weight of law and that they can override what has been passed by the legislature and executive branches.


...
- The explanations and responses to the comments on the proposed ruling make it clear that the ATF thinks their opinions have the weight of law and that they can override what has been passed by the legislature and executive branches.
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fixed it for you
 
  • Haha
Reactions: Me.
recreationalhandgrenade said:
One retailer got a boogeyman letter? Reminds me of the ares armor p80 ar15 stuff from years ago
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Now would be a great time to bring something like that back. or combine it with the "pour your own" kits and use a water soluble or hollow biscuit.
 
JohnFreeman said:
Almost like our founding fathers intended!
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You haven't but,

I've been called many things, to include a Nazi, Un-American, FUDD, Communist, Anti-American, ( there's some names that I forgot) here on this forum and "Face-To-Face."

It's my prerogative (rifle or not) to ask for what I do.
Asking to see NC Drivers License, PPP ~ CCW or a recent Gun Store receipt for the sale of a firearm ~ serialized Part or, or meet at a FFL to transfer said firearm wrinkles your panties, then don't feel left out because you are "In Very Good Company" as there are MANY that are in the same club you are.

In light of today's immigration policies, I'm sure you and those like minded won't mind supplying to some of the Free Immigrants as well.

https://www.ncfire.info/


Givem all Guns

Archie Bunker's Editorial on Gun Control​



Walk Alone.jpg
 
What if you’re one of a zillion people who bought a kit and decide to either sell it wo building it or build it and then sell it?

My question is - what about private sales?
 
rdinatal said:
From my understanding...

Once it's built you can't sell it without a SN.
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Not true with the current laws. They can recommend you add a SN all they want, but no requirement.

If you wanted to make an NFA firearm out of it, then it would require a serial number.
 
BigWaylon said:
Not true with the current laws. They can recommend you add a SN all they want, but no requirement.

If you wanted to make an NFA firearm out of it, then it would require a serial number.
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So what really changed was the commercial FFL dealer sales now require SN on items that previously didn’t require SN…?

No changes to private market…effectively.
 
Shaboomquisha said:
They said in the vidger that it could be a ruling by august
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Which is the same date they published months ago.

…which is why it’s getting merged with the topic that says the brace ruling is coming in August. 😉
 
Not sure if this has been posted here yet but, it’s all over other forums I frequent (I ponied up $900 for a Lifetime GOA a membership as a result of their filing.) since then 17 state’s Attorney Generals have signed on ..

www.gunowners.org

GOA and GOF Sue Biden’s ATF Over “Ghost Gun” Rule | GOA

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE July 8, 2022 Washington, D.C. – Earlier this week, Gun Owners of America (GOA) and Gun Owners Foundation (GOF) filed a federal lawsuit in North Dakota over the ATF’s proposed “Ghost Gun” and Gun Registry Final Rule, which is slated to take effect on August 24th. The rule...
www.gunowners.org www.gunowners.org

<snip>
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

July 8, 2022
Washington, D.C. – Earlier this week, Gun Owners of America (GOA) and Gun Owners Foundation (GOF) filed a federal lawsuit in North Dakota over the ATF’s proposed “Ghost Gun” and Gun Registry Final Rule, which is slated to take effect on August 24th. The rule, which was heavily modified from its original proposed version in light of criticism by GOA and over 65,000 comments from GOA’s grassroots members, remains of significant concern due to the vague, illegal, and unconstitutional mandates it will place on citizens, manufacturers, and parts dealers nationwide.
Among other provisions, the rule would arbitrarily require (1) background checks on gun parts such as 80% kits, (2) gun dealers to serialize and register privately made firearms, and (3) FFLs to permanently maintain all Firearm Transaction Records (Forms 4473), a change from ATF’s temporary 20-year record retention policy in violation of the Firearms Owners’ Protection Act (18 U.S.C. 926(a)(3)).
GOA and its millions of members continue to voice concerns that this is another attempt by this anti-gun administration to regulate what Congress never intended to regulate and eventually turn their partial gun registry into a complete registry of every firearm transferred. Under current policy, when an FFL dealer goes out of business, the most recent 20 years of records are transferred to ATF. But under the new record-keeping policy in the Final Rule, every transaction record would eventually be entered into ATF’s digital and searchable national gun registry.
Erich Pratt, GOA’s Senior Vice President, issued the following statement:
GOA and GOF are proud to be leading the charge against this tyrannical omnibus rule from the anti-gun Biden Administration, which will indeed bolster the ATF’s efforts to compile a complete registry of every firearm in the United States. This rule threatens the privacy of law-abiding citizens and will jeopardize the ability of numerous businesses across this country to continue to operate. Especially in light of the abusive leak of gun owner data in California, we must do everything we can to push back on these abusive anti-gun measures.
Just as alarming, despite ATF’s clear lack of ability to enforce these new rules before the regulation takes effect in August, at least two parts dealers have already received vague ‘cease and desist operations’ letters from the agency, jeopardizing their livelihoods and bolstering the need for immediate injunctive relief from the courts. Given the clear precedent handed down by the Supreme Court last month, we are confident that we will succeed in dismantling this regulation.
Aidan Johnston, GOA’s Director of Federal Affairs added: “What better way to celebrate American Independence this week than suing a tyrannical agency that’s hellbent on restricting Americans’ rights.”
GOA spokesmen are available for interviews. Gun Owners of America is a nonprofit grassroots lobbying organization dedicated to protecting the right to keep and bear arms without compromise. GOA represents over two million members and activists. For more information, visit GOA’s Press Center.
-GOA-
<End snip>
 
And also … (I couldn’t pay for a Lifetime membership quick enough!)

www.gunowners.org

GOA Lawsuit Challenges Biden’s Executive Action on Gun Owner Registration and Homemade Gun Ban | GOA

Gun Owners of America and Gun Owners Foundation are once again taking the ATF to court. GOA and GOF just filed a federal lawsuit against the ATF’s proposed “Ghost Gun” and Gun Registry Final Rule, which is slated to take effect August 24. This rule imposes near-universal gun owner registration...
www.gunowners.org www.gunowners.org

<snip>

Gun Owners of America and Gun Owners Foundation are once again taking the ATF to court.

GOA and GOF just filed a federal lawsuit against the ATF’s proposed “Ghost Gun” and Gun Registry Final Rule, which is slated to take effect August 24.

This rule imposes near-universal gun owner registration and restricts the ability to make your own guns at home—a tradition which is older than our Republic.

After the recent Supreme Court decision that reaffirmed our Second Amendment rights to keep and bear arms, we are optimistic that we can win this fight.

But I know it’s going to be a lengthy and expensive legal battle, similar to what we’ve gone through in our bump stock case, which is on appeal to the Supreme Court.

The ATF and their gun control lawyers will be fighting us tooth and nail in hopes that they can keep dragging out this legal battle until our funds are depleted.

That’s why YOUR support will be essential to keep us in the fight for however long it takes—especially since this battle may end up at the Supreme Court.

Please make a tax-deductible contribution to Gun Owners Foundation’s Legal Defense Fund to ensure we have every resource we need in our new legal battle against the ATF.

I should note that we have already put the ATF on the defensive.

Thanks to activists like you who sent over 65,000 angry comments to the ATF, the rule was HEAVILY modified from its original proposed version.

Here are three of the most significant “victories” that our pressure campaign against the ATF achieved: You will not have to serialize (read: register) every new magazine, barrel, or trigger that you use to upgrade your existing firearm.
✔️
You will not have to register a firearm simply because you Cerakote or color your firearm.
✔️
And you will have greater protection when having a gun dealer check out or modify your privately made firearm—as now, the requirement to serialize a homemade firearm has been limited to only apply when a dealer takes that gun into his inventory overnight.

In fact, the ATF explicitly concedes that they watered down the regulations because of the “numerous commenters” like you who opposed them.

Now, I want to be as clear as possible…

…While it’s good that the ATF rules were modified, a “watered down” assault on our rights is still an assault on our rights.

That’s why our legal team at Gun Owners Foundation will keep fighting until the ATF’s ENTIRE assault on our rights has been gutted.

Gun Owners Foundation firmly believes in fighting based on the text and history of the Second Amendment.

But to win this fight, we’ll certainly need support from our members like you.

So please, make a tax-deductible contribution to Gun Owners Foundation’s Legal Defense Fund to ensure we have every resource we need in our new legal battle against the ATF.

<End snip>
 
Goofyfoot2001 said:
Wouldn't it be nice if, for once, the federal government would go after the actual criminals?
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GeorgeBush said:
Criminals are job security though. Going after them would be like McDonald's launching an anti-fat campaign.
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And it’s far easier to go after criminals you create out of good law abiding citizens by making arbitary idiotic laws … they usually don’t shoot at you.
 
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NCFubar said:
And it’s far easier to go after criminals you create out of good law abiding citizens by making arbitary idiotic laws … they usually don’t shoot at you.
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“There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws.”​


― Ayn Rand
 
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