ATF moving for Amnesty Period to register pistol braced guns as SBRs

phideux said:
So even if you registered it, and it is now an SBR, you can just pull the stock off it and it's a pistol again? What if the ATF wants to see it?? Do they then get you for selling an SBR without their permission and tax??
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Yes. So what if the atf wants to see it. That doesn’t happen btw. Once you take the stock off it’s a pistol if it started out as a pistol. You’re just selling it as a pistol at that point. They like you to notify them if you do sell it as such but that’s not really a law .
 
wired said:
if it started out as a pistol. You’re just selling it as a pistol at that point.
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I think the ATF stance is they were always a Rifle, SBR to be exact.
So taking a gun that was sold with a brace and they say is a SBR from the point it was created at the factory.....

Could you legally just remove the brace (stock, we all know they were a stock) and make it into a pistol?

Yep ATF said that was one optional way. Do you trust them?
They said it was OK to prevent needing to register it as a rifle,
But where did they say you can register as an SBR then return it to a pistol?
 
Mr.Gadget said:
I think the ATF stance is they were always a Rifle, SBR to be exact.
So taking a gun that was sold with a brace and they say is a SBR from the point it was created at the factory.....

Could you legally just remove the brace (stock, we all know they were a stock) and make it into a pistol?

Yep ATF said that was one optional way. Do you trust them?
They said it was OK to prevent needing to register it as a rifle,
But where did they say you can register as an SBR then return it to a pistol?
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Thomson center v us
 
Don't think that covers building a pistol from a rifle.

If so then anyone can take any AR15 rifle and turn it into a pistol.
 
Mr.Gadget said:
Don't think that covers building a pistol from a rifle.

If so then anyone can take any AR15 rifle and turn it into a pistol.
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It covers building a rifle from a pistol then making it a pistol again. The only problem areas I see being purchasing a factory made braced pistol but even those were excise tax paid as pistols to begin with.
 
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wired said:
It covers building a rifle from a pistol then making it a pistol again. The only problem areas I see being purchasing a factory made braced pistol but even those were excise tax paid as pistols to begin with.
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Correct
Factory made I bet would require another rule or ruling.... LOL

Anyone remember the Brace on the Q firearms?
If I remember they did not allow for removal of the brace. Thought they were required to be registered as SBR.

Maybe someone here had to deal with that crap.
 
Mr.Gadget said:
Correct
Factory made I bet would require another rule or ruling.... LOL

Anyone remember the Brace on the Q firearms?
If I remember they did not allow for removal of the brace. Thought they were required to be registered as SBR.

Maybe someone here had to deal with that crap.
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Braces are stocks so it wouldn't matter. Your just stuck with an ugly stock if you cant change them. Another reason not to buy Q
 
Got my approval.

Submitted 5/10

Approved 6/23

Only thing worth noting is the Form 1 was approved "conditionally" with a note at the end stating it was part of the ATF Rule 2021R-08F (the stabilizing brace debacle).
 
9outof10mms said:
Got my approval.

Submitted 5/10

Approved 6/23

Only thing worth noting is the Form 1 was approved "conditionally" with a note at the end stating it was part of the ATF Rule 2021R-08F (the stabilizing brace debacle).
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Me. said:
That is a huge (and illogical) stretch. Not that the ATF is above illogical stretches.


If the thing were shot down, you'd still have a registered/approved SBR. It wouldn't invalidate the Form 1. It would let you remove the stock, and magically transform the gun back into a pistol by putting the brace on.
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I guess it depends on how it gets “shot down.” If it is invalidated ab initio (as if it never existed) then a braced pistol is still a braced pistol, but if the brace has been replaced with a stock then it is an untaxed SBR. I don’t think there could be a successful prosecution of a holder of such an SBR given the process we’ve been through, but I can see ATF sending a letter saying that it either needed to remain a braced pistol or a $200 pmt is required.
 
GymB said:
I don’t think there could be a successful prosecution of a holder of such an SBR given the process we’ve been through
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Yeah…. We all thought the same thing when pistol braces first came out and the ATF said they were OK. And now you are a felon if you didn’t take their free candy they were offering.
 
Crankbait said:
Yeah…. We all thought the same thing when pistol braces first came out and the ATF said they were OK. And now you are a felon if you didn’t take their free candy they were offering.
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Who is a felon?
So far no convictions, prosecutions or even arrests.
 
GymB said:
I guess it depends on how it gets “shot down.” If it is invalidated ab initio (as if it never existed) then a braced pistol is still a braced pistol, but if the brace has been replaced with a stock then it is an untaxed SBR. I don’t think there could be a successful prosecution of a holder of such an SBR given the process we’ve been through, but I can see ATF sending a letter saying that it either needed to remain a braced pistol or a $200 pmt is required.
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It would have to be a very specific and targeted ruling at the SCOTUS level for that to happen. The ATF has a long history of ignoring lower court rulings entirely and non-specific court rulings even at a high level. It would have to the the equivalent of a Thompson Center V US where SCOTUS basically tells the ATF EXACTLY what to do.
 
9outof10mms said:
Got my approval.

Submitted 5/10

Approved 6/23

Only thing worth noting is the Form 1 was approved "conditionally" with a note at the end stating it was part of the ATF Rule 2021R-08F (the stabilizing brace debacle).
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The conditional thing is just the explanation of no tax stamp. Doesnt change the approval of the form 1 status. I have a few others that have conditional status for one thing or another.
 
GymB said:
Who is a felon?
So far no convictions, prosecutions or even arrests.
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Either way I don’t think saying there couldn’t be a successful persecution is true. There’s too many looneys up there that do as they please. There’s no telling what the outcome will be until it gets through the courts and such. I knew it would get tied up so that’s why I stayed out and didn’t play by their so called rules
 
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Crankbait said:
Either way I don’t think saying there couldn’t be a successful persecution is true. There’s too many looneys up there that do as they please. There’s no telling what the outcome will be until it gets through the courts and such. I knew it would get tied up so that’s why I stayed out and didn’t play by their so called rules
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So not playing by their rules kept you safe?
 
Crankbait said:
Either way I don’t think saying there couldn’t be a successful persecution is true. There’s too many looneys up there that do as they please. There’s no telling what the outcome will be until it gets through the courts and such. I knew it would get tied up so that’s why I stayed out and didn’t play by their so called rules
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I said that I didn’t think there could be a successful prosecution in one possible scenario. Once the courts decide what they want to do, and IMO they are going to defer to the agency, then we can figure out the risks.

By stayed out do you mean that you never owned a braced pistol?
 
GymB said:
I said that I didn’t think there could be a successful prosecution in one possible scenario. Once the courts decide what they want to do, and IMO they are going to defer to the agency, then we can figure out the risks.

By stayed out do you mean that you never owned a braced pistol?
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DrScaryGuy said:
no guarantee. i submitted 2 on the last day, and my 2 from feb 7 are still pending as well
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I was spoiled by ATF in the past so didn't imagine it would take this long. Long wait times were for other people. 😆

I think my quickest Form 1 was 9 days, and the Form 4 silencer from Capitol Armory last year was less than 90 days from certification to receipt of stamp.
 
GymB said:
By stayed out do you mean that you never owned a braced pistol?
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I own them. I reckon that means I’m in the fight 😆 I did think about paying for my stamp but decided not to. I would not take the free stamp though, nothing free is ever free from the government
 
Me. said:
You don’t need to be convicted to be a felon. You just need to be doing something the state deems a felony.
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A felon is literally someone convicted of a felony. Moreover, it’s downright un-American of you to say that someone becomes a felon without due process.
 
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