NC PPP law?

Jayne said:
There is always glock vs. sig or 1911 vs. anything that doesn't suck.
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Shouldn’t need a PPP to buy a hipoint, it’s barely a pistol.

I was going to say CZ to stir things up, but thought I’d get banned.
 
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I’m too lazy to read all the replies, but was just reading up on things and found this on NC Sherries doc. I realize this isn’t the law per se but worth reading.

“In addition, this State law has been interpreted to require that a pistol permit be obtained by the receiver of a handgun when such person inherits a pistol as a result of the death of another person. The permit should be given to and retained by the seller or donor of the handgun. In such a case, the permit should be given to the executor or receiver of the estate of the deceased person. If the purchaser or receiver uses a North Carolina-issued concealed carry permit for the transfer, the seller should reference such permit on a bill of sale.”
 
Mathieu18 said:
I’m too lazy to read all the replies, but was just reading up on things and found this on NC Sherries doc. I realize this isn’t the law per se but worth reading.

“In addition, this State law has been interpreted to require that a pistol permit be obtained by the receiver of a handgun when such person inherits a pistol as a result of the death of another person. The permit should be given to and retained by the seller or donor of the handgun. In such a case, the permit should be given to the executor or receiver of the estate of the deceased person. If the purchaser or receiver uses a North Carolina-issued concealed carry permit for the transfer, the seller should reference such permit on a bill of sale.”
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With all respect. Without researching it all, again, I’m fairly certain that nowhere in the statute does it say what our idiot governor interpreted as AG.
 
fieldgrade said:
With all respect. Without researching it all, again, I’m fairly certain that nowhere in the statute does it say what our idiot governor interpreted as AG.
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Ha, No respect needed. But I’ll argue it’s worth being aware of how our Sherrifs or Pooper are interpreting the law, as that’s how they’ll try and charge you. You can be right and still found guilty.
 
Mathieu18 said:
Ha, No respect needed. But I’ll argue it’s worth being aware of how our Sherrifs or Pooper are interpreting the law, as that’s how they’ll try and charge you. You can be right and still found guilty.
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I concur.
 
Mathieu18 said:
You can be right and still found guilty.
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If your prosecutor takes the approach of our-idiot-governor-when-AG, make 'em cite where the law says "the seller shall"... make 'em prove your guilt. In other words, make them convict you of breaking a law that does not exist. Then appeal.
 
MacEntyre said:
If your prosecutor takes the approach of our-idiot-governor-when-AG, make 'em cite where the law says "the seller shall"... make 'em prove your guilt. In other words, make them convict you of breaking a law that does not exist. Then appeal.
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I assume that opinion piece was written to encourage folks to do stuff not required and to use as leverage in settlements, I can’t find it having seen the inside of a courtroom.
 
Every attorney I’ve ever met said you do everything you can to avoid trial.
 
Mathieu18 said:
Every attorney I’ve ever met said you do everything you can to avoid trial.
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Most Americans never encounter a dedicated trial lawyer. The British have barristers (trial lawyers) and solicitors (other lawyers), which is actually a good idea because the skill sets are different.
 
gc70 said:
Most Americans never encounter a dedicated trial lawyer. The British have barristers (trial lawyers) and solicitors (other lawyers), which is actually a good idea because the skill sets are different.
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Same here, we just call the trial lawyers litigators.
Lots of specialization in the practice of law, your tax guy isn’t your property guy isn’t your defense guy isn’t your speeding ticket guy isn’t your financing guy isn’t your transaction guy etc etc.
 
gc70 said:
Most Americans never encounter a dedicated trial lawyer. The British have barristers (trial lawyers) and solicitors (other lawyers), which is actually a good idea because the skill sets are different.
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Ha that’s fair. I’ve never been to trial and I agree the trial lawyer is likely another lawyer with the firm. They probably just didn’t want to pass billable off to someone else.
 
Mathieu18 said:
Ha that’s fair. I’ve never been to trial and I agree the trial lawyer is likely another lawyer with the firm. They probably just didn’t want to pass billable off to someone else.
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It would be worth your time to attend a local Superior Court session to watch the lawyers. Honestly, a good para-legal could be as effective as most lawyers in routine court matters, but a good trial lawyer's performance can be awesome.
 
gc70 said:
It would be worth your time to attend a local Superior Court session to watch the lawyers. Honestly, a good para-legal could be as effective as most lawyers in routine court matters, but a good trial lawyer's performance can be awesome.
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I have some good friends that are attorneys, trial or not, I do appreciate the difference. I think the point though it that a trial always has a degree of uncertainty. There's a lot of glibness here "take me to court and show me the statute." Well your trial could go the wrong way with the wrong DA or judge. I appreciate everyone's staunch defense of the constitution and our state laws, but consider what hill you're maybe willing to die on. Keeping a PPP or not probably isn't mine, but if its yours (the collective, not you specifically) I can respect that.

Seems its not stipulated for individuals, but it is for dealers. And a Dem AG wrote an opinion and the sherrifs endorsed it that you should always collect a PPP. We still have a Dem AG. That's not good odds if you decide to fight it.
 
Mathieu18 said:
That's not good odds if you decide to fight it.
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And yet, has anyone ever lost?

You believe that the odds are heavily in the state’s favor, but if they have never won doesn’t it cause you to rethink your assessment of the odds?
 
Mathieu18 said:
I have some good friends that are attorneys, trial or not, I do appreciate the difference. I think the point though it that a trial always has a degree of uncertainty. There's a lot of glibness here "take me to court and show me the statute." Well your trial could go the wrong way with the wrong DA or judge. I appreciate everyone's staunch defense of the constitution and our state laws, but consider what hill you're maybe willing to die on. Keeping a PPP or not probably isn't mine, but if its yours (the collective, not you specifically) I can respect that.
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I agree trials always involve an uncertainty factor and some folks exhibit a degree of misplaced bravado about dealing with the law.

The truth is there is nearly no chance of being charged with a gun sale violation unless a person sets out to illegally sell a gun (and precious little chance of being charged then). Anyone who is charged will nearly certainly be unwittingly involved in something bigger and nastier (i.e. selling to a mass shooter) than a technical gun sale violation. Bluntly, a person in such a situation will be a prosecution target regardless of what was done or not done in a gun sale. And the prosecution will be less about proving technicalities of the gun sale than convincing the jury of guilt by association with the resultant ugly event.
 
Id be interested to see if anyone has a case they know of where someone got in trouble as the seller in a private transaction due to improper paperwork passing or whatever. Im sure some have been nailed for knowingly selling to a felon or prohibited person. But not sure I have ever heard of anyone getting in trouble due to not seeing a permit or keeping one.

Not saying it hasnt happened. Just seems kinda like something that would be tacked on as a charge with something else >like< selling knowingly to a prohibited person.
 
I was approached at a gun show by a local guy with a Ted Cruz tee shirt on, in the spring of 2016. I know he was local, because I've seen him since. I had a pistol for sale, hanging from my neck. Anyway, he gave me a long story including a libertarian rant about how he didn't have any permits, shouldn't need one, but he wanted to buy a pistol for his son, so would I sell him my pistol. No permit, straw purchase, libertarian rant, Ted Cruz tee shirt... looked like a Narc to me. So, I kept him talking while repeatedly telling him he was not allowed to purchase a pistol. Got his phone number, said to keep in touch... his handlers must have thought, What a colossal waste of time!
 
I look at it like this! Just cover your own a%# and have a someone with a FFL transfer it from you to them! Someone else mentioned in an earlier post about this. If the seller and buyer are to cheap to do it the legal way to cover both of you then keep it! Spend 10 to 15 bucks to keep yourself out of prison, hmmmm sounds like it would be worth it! Otherwise add it to the gun price from the start! Most around my area are about 25 to 35 dollars to do a transfer! That is if you want to be a law abiding citizen! Criminals are not law abiding citizens and that’s why they are called criminals lol! Had an officer tell me a notarized bill of sell is enough to keep you from being responsible for anything done with the firearm from the date and time it was notarized! But to cover yourself still do what you need to do according to the law! Bad when it’s someone else getting you in trouble because of your negligence!
 
KB74 said:
Had an officer tell me a notarized bill of sell is enough to keep you from being responsible for anything done with the firearm from the date and time it was notarized!
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Would you get marriage counseling from a divorce lawyer?
 
KB74 said:
I look at it like this! Just cover your own a%# and have a someone with a FFL transfer it from you to them! Someone else mentioned in an earlier post about this. If the seller and buyer are to cheap to do it the legal way to cover both of you then keep it! Spend 10 to 15 bucks to keep yourself out of prison, hmmmm sounds like it would be worth it! Otherwise add it to the gun price from the start! Most around my area are about 25 to 35 dollars to do a transfer! That is if you want to be a law abiding citizen! Criminals are not law abiding citizens and that’s why they are called criminals lol! Had an officer tell me a notarized bill of sell is enough to keep you from being responsible for anything done with the firearm from the date and time it was notarized! But to cover yourself still do what you need to do according to the law! Bad when it’s someone else getting you in trouble because of your negligence!
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For any other new folks following this thread looking for wise counsel on what the NC statutes require, and what they do not...

This is not the way. No offense to you KB, but this post is long on opinion and conjecture, and very short on actual NC firearms statutes and what they require.
 
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Langley said:
Ok I’ve tried searching and can’t seem to find the answer. When someone is purchasing a pistol from a from a private selling. Does the original PPP need to be given to the seller or is it just shown. Looking for the actual law and not what you do 🤷🏽
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45/70fan said:
A purchase permit is a one time use, you need to keep it, With a CCW all you need to do is see it and make sure the NCDL matches.
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BigWaylon said:
It’s not. It’s up to the buyer to not reuse it.

An FFL has to keep it…an individual does not.
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@Etruett
 
divisionarmsllc said:
Under North Carolina law, it is unlawful for any person, firm, or corporation to sell, give away, transfer, purchase, or receive, at any place in the State, any pistol, unless the purchaser or receiver has first obtained a license or permit to receive such a pistol by the sheriff of the county where the purchaser or receiver resides, or the purchaser or receiver possesses a valid North Carolina issued concealed carry permit. This requirement to obtain a permit prior to the transfer of a pistol applies not only to a commercial transaction, typically at a sporting goods store, but also between private individuals or companies throughout North Carolina.

N.C. Gen. Stat. § 14-402(a).
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Uh Oh!!! @Etruett
 
Langley said:
I didn’t think it was but was searching like crazy to ensure that was correct, I have collected them in the past but was recently told that it doesn’t “have” to be handed over.
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I don't find any statute requiring that the PPP be turned over to the seller; but, prudence dictates that the seller should at least make a copy of the PPP if the buyer does not want to surrender it. The seller should keep proof that he sold to a person authorized by statute to purchase a gun. Even with a CHP buyer, at least get the info off the CHP. If a buyer will not let me photocopy the PPP or CHP, I can elect not to sell them a gun. It is for my own protection.
 
Kassar said:
I don't find any statute requiring that the PPP be turned over to the seller; but, prudence dictates that the seller should at least make a copy of the PPP if the buyer does not want to surrender it. The seller should keep proof that he sold to a person authorized by statute to purchase a gun. Even with a CHP buyer, at least get the info off the CHP. If a buyer will not let me photocopy the PPP or CHP, I can elect not to sell them a gun. It is for my own protection.
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Many, if not most folks here prefer not to have their personally identifying information floating around with people who are otherwise strangers to them, due to reasonable and prudent privacy concerns.

Probably more folks than you realize. But as you say, it is your choice to make. Just be sure you state that clearly in any “for sale” ad you post, because if you don’t tell your buyer till after a deal is already struck, and it sours the deal for the buyer (and you) it will be viewed very dimly here.
 
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